The administration got its first taste of the growing American opposition to NSA surveillance and its impact on Congress today, when despite overwhelming opposition from both parties leadership, the White House and heavy lobbying by the NSA, Rep. Justin Amash (R – MI) brought the matter of telephone surveillance to a vote.
The amendment failed, unfortunately, but the 205-217 vote showed that many in the House were willing to buck party leadership in favor of the American public’s demands to see the NSA powers curbed.
Public opponent is overwhelmingly against the NSA’s surveillance, but it takes a long time for it to trickle into the halls of Congress, and even longer to find its way into the Senate. That the Amash Amendment managed not only to get a hearing but to come within a hair’s breadth of passing is an encouraging sign that public sentiment is starting to get noticed on this issue.
Each side got just 7 minutes and 30 seconds to debate the matter, though the opposition to Amash (led by Rep. Mike Rogers (R – MI)) really didn’t need nearly so much time, focusing almost exclusively on accusing opponents of the NSA of “forgetting 9/11.”
The debate also included opposition condemning whistleblower Edward Snowden for even making the surveillance program public, and accusing him of aiding “the enemy” by making the details available. They insisted that was “all” he had done.
But without Snowden, the Amash Amendment could never have existed, the American public would never have known about this NSA overreach, nor could they have pushed so many in Congress to oppose it.
The vote is a defeat for privacy today, but it is a battle that will continue on.
Surprised to see more Democrats voting for this than Republicans. So much for the idea that Republicans make a good opposition to a Democratic president.
Obama is just continuing the work started by Bush and Cheney. Cheney has complimented him the good job. Obama has moved to the right of the Republicans on the national security state, so they are hardly going to seriously complain.
If you pay attention to the money, in 2007 you could see all of the money that had backed Bush/Cheney shift over to the Obama campaign. Bush had raised about $375 mil in both 2000 and 2004. In 2008, McCain had to go onto public financing because he couldn't raise more than $90 mil, while Obama raised $750 mil. See where the money that had backed Bush went?
I wonder if the NSA list of the senators which they have listened to their phones or hacked their emails and text messages hade anything to do with Amash losing?
Since this vote was in the House, probably not much.
Now we know which side the congressmen are on, liberty or statism. It makes voting so much easier.
NSA gathering data on everybody is just the tip of the iceberg. Think of this; All those shopping networks and other retailers have been doing essentially the same thing that NSA has been doing, but then they have the audacity to sell that collected data without our consents to third parties who turn around and inundate us with phone calls and spam. They're not only snooping, they're also harassing. Talk about invasion of Privacy! Talk about violating my 4th amendment right not to be bothered.
Actually, you probably did consent if you read the fine print on that 'Shoppers Club' card you signed up for.
Just enough to allow the hollow men to strut and pretend they value freedom but never actually doing anything.
I'm betting there are already re-election posters made up touting their "rage against the machine" and how they were defeated by those who aren't as serious about protecting our rights.
One has to wonder if some of the AYE votes were arranged for those up for election ("Look at me, Defender of Freedom"), with the result being predetermined. And what about the twelve non-votes? Let's say the twelve all voted AYE to make it a tie for the "magic-bullet-Biden" to break in favor of Fearless Leader Obama. What a tragic comedy.
IIRC, another article about the vote indicated that the amendment only failed by 7 votes – for a total needed to pass of 212. And yes, the Whip's job is not only to count votes but in the counting, provide guidance to those who need re-election cover to wave the flag and bamboozle the voter.
These programs (collection of phone meta-data and PRISM et al) clearly breach the 4th Amendment of the US Constitution, which states, “The right of the people to be secure in
their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and
seizures, shall not be violated….”.
If you don't think that the founding fathers meant by the 4th amendment the 21 century equivalent (phone and on-line comms as well as all manner of electronic tracking devices built into our entertainment, transportation and communication devices) then you are the worst type of apologist for the authoritarian police-state presently being birthed in Washington D.C. There is one word that describes those who help protect the NSA's domestic spying program against American citizens in violation of the Constitution; That word is traitor.
All done in the name of "protecting" our rights and the Homeland, too. The fact that they are shredding the Constitution is not relevant to them since they've determined that "if the homeland isn't safe then the Constitution won't matter." They are not Patriots, no matter how vehemently claim.
Traitors always spin BS to cover themselves. You're listening to and quoting the BS. Its doubtful they even believe this stuff themselves. This is just the spin they throw out.
Patriotism has always been the last refuge of scoundrels.
Obviously, my use of sarcasm was perhaps too subtle…
Plus, don't forget the 9th Amendment. It basically says that just because the Bill of Rights listed some specific rights, that this doesn't mean we give up all others. The 9th Amendment clearly says anything not covered is still a right held by the people and protected. Thus, if you put the 4th and 9th Amendments together, they clearly say that any forms of communication that developed after the horse and buggy area are still to be protected from search and seizure.
Closer than I thought considering the conflict of interest many in Congress have with ties to the military industrial complex. Some hope.
On an unpopular votes, once the leadership has enough votes to win, they'll "release" other votes. It was a free vote to vote the way the citizens obviously want once the leadership vote counts told them they had enough to win. Thus, some of the votes against the NSA would probably have voted in favor had their votes been needed or their arms twisted.
Here is how you stop the unconstitutional NSA program: You vote against your representative if he/she was one of the traitors to vote against the Amash amendment. Simple.
If you believe in fairy tales and your representative is not owned by the Koch Brothers.
I love how every appeal to get people to vote these fools out is immediately answered by someone trying to tell you not to vote. I sense a pattern there. Of course you should vote out the fools that voted for this amendment. Especially if your rep is owned by the Koch brothers.
The worst thing you can do is to listen to the people who constantly tell you not to vote. You need to do more than vote. But at the very least, you should take the 5 minutes it takes to vote against these people that Thomas Jefferson would regard as traitors.
I think you meant "vote out the fools that voted "against" this amendment" because voting for the amendment was a good move and would have hamstrung the NSA.
How is that believing in fairy tales? It might be too much to expect over 50% of the voters in many Congressional districts to have the intelligence to do what is needed, but if it becomes a campaign issue and many of the dregs are voted out, then it will change the course of things.
I sent an email to my representative thanking him for his vote in favor of the Amash amendment.
Yet we ee the same dreary obsessed little people re-elected for decades.
The 50% intelligent votes are sadly missing. The propaganda, paid for by their backers, is omnipresent.
Since corporations have been declared people, they talk non stop.
When I see people like Steve King, Michelle Bachmann, Louie Gohmert, and Todd Aiken continually get re-elected I find it hard to put much faith in the voting public. There being scant proof there is any intelligent thought being applied. When the voters start weeding out the wackos then I'll re-evaluate my opinion of the voting class.
The only thing I will never "forget" about 9/11 is that the Capitol wasn't hit.
NSA tracking happening just like the film predicted. PRISM is eerily like the fictitious URTS in the indi film that came out a few years ago "Uncivil Liberties". The hero of the story is like Snowden. Wonder if he was inspired to act by the film. uncivilliberties.com to see the trailer.
2 thoughts ….
1) Votes like this are very tricky to judge. The leadership counts votes closely. And once they have enough to win, they'll release votes. Everyone knows the citizens are against this, so if they face any sort of challenge in the next election (and they all should), then they want to vote against the NSA to look good to the voters who oppose these policies. But, many of them would have voted in favor of the NSA if their votes had been needed to win. Not every vote against the NSA is on our side. But at least we've got a list of the ones who definitely are NOT on our side.
2) What sort of files does the NSA have on Congresspeople? If the NSA needed the votes, how many congresspeople did they approach and say that the sext pics of their genitals would be made public before the next election if they didn't vote the NSA way?