Russian President Vladimir Putin on Thursday strongly warned the US against allowing Ukraine to use NATO missiles in long-range strikes inside Russian territory, saying the move would put the Western military alliance “at war with Russia.”
Putin’s comments came after POLITICO reported that the White House was finalizing plans to expand the areas inside Russia where Ukraine can use US and British-provided missiles.
“This would in a significant way change the very nature of the conflict,” Putin told a TV reporter, according to AFP. “It would mean that NATO countries, the US, European countries, are at war with Russia. If that’s the case, then taking into account the change of nature of the conflict, we will take the appropriate decisions based on the threats that we will face.”
He added that supporting long-range Ukrainian strikes inside Russian territory is “a decision on whether NATO countries are directly involved in the military conflict or not.”
A day earlier, US Secretary of State Antony Blinken and UK Foreign Secretary David Lammy met with Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky in Kyiv and discussed the issue of long-range strikes. At a press conference in Kyiv, Blinken said they would take the conversation back to their “bosses” and strongly hinted the US was preparing to take the escalatory step.
“Speaking for the United States, from day one, as you’ve heard me say, we have adjusted and adapted as needs have changed, as the battlefield has changed, and I have no doubt that we’ll continue to do that,” Blinken said.
The Guardian reported that a decision has already been made in private to allow Ukraine to use British-provided Storm Shadow missiles, which have a range of about 155 miles. The report said the decision is not expected to be made public in the near future, not even after President Biden meets with British Prime Minister Keir Starmer this Friday.
Earlier this year, a German military leak revealed that British soldiers are “on the ground” in Ukraine helping fire Storm Shadows, which means if they’re used to launch long-range strikes inside Russia, it would be with direct support from the British military.
Yeah, that ship has sailed.
It hasn’t sailed that Russia responds. The US and UK believe Russia will back down and not use nukes against NATO, but we could soon see nukes. It might come down to what Russian response China is willing to tolerate.
The thing is, if Russia attacks Poland or Germany conventionally, NATO might respond with nukes. The threat becomes such that nukes will be used as a preemptive strike by one side or the other.
Whoever nukes first loses the PR battle but reduces the responding force.
In the digital age nukes are the equivalent of horse mounted cavalry. Putin should concentrate on blinding (radar, Reapers, AWACS, satelites) NATO, making their guided weaponry useless.
Ramstein with the big military hospital next door would be a great target, drones used in the ME were and may still be guided from Ramstein AB.
The idea should be to avoid casualties since “the blody shirt” would classicly be used to jingo the folk and justify retaliating with blunderbus nukes. Putin, I’m sure, would like to preserve a livable world.
Two Years in, Russia’s War on Ukraine Continues to Pose Threat to Global Security
NATO war in Ukraine continues 10 years.
LOL
Russia annexed Crimea, not DC!!!
"nukes are the equivalent of horse mounted cavalry"
How does that work?
Horrible damage to all sides.
Not so far. No Damage to all sides in 1945.
If that’s possible, but if they start shooting down one another’s satellites, it could cause problems for everyone. Russia seems to want Elon Musk level satellites now. Maybe the US won’t allow it.
Better we all go back to the ’50’s, than the stone age.
I'll opvote because its funny but in the 1950's Stalin tried to Russifie us
The Russians may start by expanding their list of targets to include supply lines (known & evidenced as running weapons) in NATO countries to Ukraine. And airfields, radar & intel installations. All military, and all complicit.
The RF will not want to provoke sympathy for NATO among NATO-nation citizens. If the Russians tag Polish, Romanian military sites exclusively and show their war is against NATO and not the member countries per se, it'd force the question across NATO-state civilians, "Why the f**k is my country provoking the Russians??"
Russia will not directly attack a NATO nation. They are not that stupid.
You never know; much like their Nazi friends, the Russian Duma is like a psych ward where you can control the lives of 150 million people
Much of the upper command of the Nazi state was basically a haven for people with mental disorder
We devoted a whole day to it in my university classes once. Still don't know why except to compare with Rusia, but it was cool
While it is true that one never knows what a person like Putin will do next. The chance that Russian generals would follow his command is low. They know just how badly Russia would get mauled going against top line NATO troops. However, you are correct that people like Putin tends to surround themself with crazy people.
Yeah its a weird trend among dictators
Trump does the same thing. He surround himself with some really weird people.
Yup
My point is that this has always been a war instigated, supported and armed by NATO (the US) and these pretend limitations set by the US are transparent.
How Putin perceives direct engagement and response is another story.
Since the USA is located on another continent, thousands of miles removed from the battle zone, they do not have to consider the kind of destruction the USA heaps on other nations on other continents. That may change, but the mad neocons would not admit it even if they know. They live in their own big bubble.
For all we know Washington is a priority target for Russia in a nuclear WW III.
Realistically, Russia isn't about to invade Poland or anyplace else with the problems they have presently resupplying and restocking the cannon fodder. Granted, they still have a lot in reserve, but considering how quickly it all bogged down in Ukraine, they will need "at least a few months in the hospital" before they are out the door & ready to rage on Poland. Or anyplace else.
WW3 wouldn't be a classic "invade, conquer, hold" strategy, inching towards their capitol.
More like, "nuclear strikes to disable command & control apparatae plus retalitory capabilities and wipe out leadership, then threaten whatever is left with nuking cities and population centers if what's left of the State doesn't surrender."
For the RF this means vaporise NORAD, Washington DC, major bases and nuclear-triad airfields and silos, hope your Intel on boomer subs is accurate to get them too. Then tell the Secretary of Agriculture, now the acting President, that Chicago, LA, Seattle et. al. are next unless the USA surrenders.
And let NATO allies know they're next if they vote YES on Article V.
i think it'd be tactical nukes; best to do as little damage as possible to at least attempt to get less nuked
a tactical nuke can have the same effect as a real nuke without all the collateral damage
Tactical nukes are "real" nukes. Most are quite a bit more powerful than the A-bombs dropped on Japan.
Oh
Thats a shame
Russia is not going to attack Poland or Germany.
Russia has not even totally attacked Ukraine.
Russia saved Crimea from the Ukraine menace
but they halted their aggressive invasion at that point.
what do you mean they haven't toally attacked us?
What do you mean we are a menace?
What do you mean "they haled their aggressive invasion?"
We're at 10 years of this sh*tshow because Putin couldn't take the L, and almost 1k days of the full scale invasion
“what do you mean they haven’t toally attacked us?”
At 2 1/2 years into the war, with the Russian forces not even having successfully secured Donetsk yet, some of the warmongers (pro-Russian version) have long since been reduced to claiming that it isn’t that the Russian forces can’t win, it’s that they haven’t started trying to win yet.
Yes, it’s stupid.
No, it’s not surprising.
It’s the equivalent of the US “well, if we’d just do a SURGE” nonsense.
..into the all consuming vortex.
"The Guardian reported that a decision has already been made in private to allow Ukraine to use British-provided Storm Shadow missiles, which have a range of about 155 miles…"
this is inaccurate. Storm Shadow missiles have a range up to around 500 km.
and for those who don't know, that's about the distance from the Ukrainian border areas to Moscow.
Different ranges are given all over the place, ranging from the 150+ to 250 to 500 km and I read somewhere even 550 km. But wouldn't that be a moot point anyway? It does not seem to be much up for debate about whether the Russians will be in the right to respond depending on an experimental verification of the exact number to this particular parameter.
i want to play with some storm shadows in like 10 months
i would love to fire a missile at the kremlin and put the bear ot sleep
"allowing Ukraine to use NATO missiles", "Ukraine can use US and Britain – provided missiles" – why Antiwar repeating all this nonsense? Ukraine can't use long range precision missiles. Only NATO specialists can do it. It is understandable why neocons are pushing it on Ukraine, but it is difficult to understand why "antiwar" is doing the same. There no difference whether NATO attacks Russia from NATO countries territory, from neutral waters or from Ukraine. It would be exactly the same: direct NATO aggression against Russia.
“Ukrainians are incapable of doing stuff, it must be someone else” is a pretty weak argument.
If only “NATO specialists” are capable of firing long-range missiles, then who’s firing all those Russian missiles at Ukraine?
Ukraine never used long range precision missiles because never had them. Only NATO specialists can set the flight mission for the long range precision missiles. Reconnaissance for those missiles also can be provided only by those countries who have the satellites fit for the job. Ukraine has it not. Ukraine can provide for those missiles only the launch pad.
Months of training Ukrainian soldiers would be required first. British troops are firing storm shadow missiles at Russia from Ukraine.
https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2024/mar/04/british-soldiers-on-ground-ukraine-german-military-leak
How much training would be required is definitely debatable.
Ukraine had missiles and missile fire control technicians long before this war started.
It may take months to learn to operate a TYPE of weapon system, but it doesn’t necessarily take months to learn to operate a PARTICULAR VARIANT of that weapon system.
You are correct it does not take months to learn how to fire a missile.
Sure, we could debate how much training the Ukrainians would need to fire western long range weapons deep into Russia, and we could debate how much anyone cares if they hit what they're shooting at. US weapons fired using US military satellites and uniformed US/UK "trainers" and "advisors" in Ukraine picking targets begs the question of when this becomes a direct declared war between NATO and Russia. Soon indeed for the warmongers who insist Ukraine must somehow achieve something that can be spun as a victory.
Would they train them to use American military satellites? It is just a smokescreen for western public. I see, some people are glad to be cheated. The plain fact is: those missiles can't be operated by Ukrainian militaries.
NATO personnel were among the 700 or so KIA in the military training camp in Ukraine, including a number of Swedes. The price to pay for giving up more than a century old neutrality.
Russia Invades Ukraine: A Timeline of the Crisis
https://www.usnews.com/news/best-countries/slideshows/a-timeline-of-the-russia-ukraine-conflict
There is a narrative and there is a reality, Russia does know that they are at war with NATO and not Ukraine and they do know that after the last Ukrainian man standing it is Europe's turn, NATO and EU and the continent will perish, the Biden regime took care of that already. Like Kissinger said, to have the USA as a friend is fatal, we have proof of it.
If things continue as they've been going, I'll be long dead and in my grave by the time we get to the "last Ukrainian man standing" point.
The last Ukrainian will be gone before you go, they get thrown in the meatgrinder faster than you can look. They may get replaced with NATO guys like the Swedes and Fins and Poles. The Germans will not send their soldiers while the Ukrainian men take refuge in Germany. But the ample-coalition and Scholz will disappear first, I hope.
Well, that's about as clear as it gets. Hit us, we hit you. It's not a threat – it's math.
The US hits first, the ruling elite calls it "preemptive" when they do it and against international law when others do it.
Exxon was instrumental in starting the war in Ukraine. They had signed a $30 Billion oil and gas deal which was going bad under the government overthrown in 2014.
The oil and gas was located in Eastern Ukraine and Crimea.
ok russkie
Keep this crap up and you will find your sorry ass banned!
I have been a person of peace since the damn day I was born!
When you effort to insult people, it simply says, you don’t have much worth saying!
You cant do that
And even if you could, it would be because my opinions don’t fit with your incorrect narrative
Look friend, you are just a simpleton and that I truly find tragic!
I am whst educated people call a “primary source” I live in the country being r*ped. You live in a bunker 100ft underground
Dude,
I live in an old mobile home. No búnker but a good bit of weed to make the trip shorter: Heaven. 😉
oooooooh
we can only use it for medical purposes
after I turned 18 I went to the Netherlands. I asked a dutch friend if only tourists partook. He said yes.
SO I did
Amsterdam is best city in world, and more than just for weed. I want to go there more often after my service in the AFU.
I recommend anyone to go!
"Putin is bluffing" might be our famous last words. …I'm kidding. They're not going to be "famous" because NOBODY is going to hear us say those words and NOBODY is going to care.
Are you $hitting me!? How crazy are we? …Except, I would really like to find out. The funny thing is I will try to tell you guys when it happens, but we will all be gone!
So I did the math. The crazy thing is as soon as we find out exactly how crazy we are, history ends. If history is written by the winners, there ain't gonna be any of them around to write any FU@KING HISTORY!
LOL. Sorry for repeating myself. I can't stop laughing since I realized that Biden is not as demented and as at fault as we are.
I knew it, Thomas. Putin is as stupid as the rest of the Russians. Hurry up. Tell me what else can we do to convince him that we want nuclear war with Russia?
Not sure what you mean.
I was just arguing with the contention that Ukrainians can’t operate anything more complex than a can opener and that therefore “NATO specialists” have to come run the toasterr ovens, microwaves, etc.
As is often the case, I tend to think that Putin is a lot smarter than his supporters here seem to believe he is.
Yes, he made a mistake invading Ukraine.
Yes, he has to save a certain amount of face in getting his teat out of the wringer — he has to be able to declare “victory” with at least a fig leaf of credibility.
But no, he has no plans to try and take over Europe. He’s just trying to slow down the decline of the Russian empire as much as he can.
Agreed with everything you said with the exception of “He’s just trying to slow down the decline of the Russian empire…” I said from the beginning that Ukraine was an obvious trap for Russia and was a mistake. “He is just trying” to save Russia–And indirectly save the world. A point over which, you and I have to disagree.
Your last sentence is misplaced. It applies to the nation headed by the current mentally handicapped occupant of the WH and his sycophants, who are under the direction of the same gang of criminally obsessed jackasses who have been fomenting wars, destabilization, and violence all around the globe for nearly half a century, resulting in the deaths of millions of innocents.
Sorry but this is more the West trying to slow down the decline of the "Western"(ie US led) dollar denominated empire. Russia (as well as BRICS) is actually ascendant and the West is trying to keep it down–and failing. If it were still possible, I would invest in a Russian ETF.
He might be bluffing about starting nuclear war, but we certainly are not.
Putin is stating the obvious. If the US and/or UK approve Ukrainian use of long-range missiles against Russian territory, "This means war."
That does not mean Russia will respond with violence, because a violent response is exactly what the US/UK/NATO are hoping for.
And I'm grateful that cool heads are in charge at the Kremlin, because there don't seem to be any at the US State Dept.
But when I saw the story in today's WaPo and looked at the top comments, the commenters were all in favor of launching missiles into Russia. Even though the article made it plain that Russia would view that as entering a state of war. Proof once again that propaganda is powerful and that once the target audience is indoctrinated it is slow to recover.
From the Kremlin website, September 12, 2024:
Answer to a media question
Following his address to the plenary session of the United Cultures Forum, Vladimir Putin answered a question from a media representative.
Question: Over the past few days, we have been hearing statements at a very high level in the UK and the United States that the Kiev regime will be allowed to strike targets deep inside Russia using Western long-range weapons. Apparently, this decision is either about to be made, or has already been made, as far as we can see. This is actually quite extraordinary. Could you comment on what is going on?
President of Russia Vladimir Putin: What we are seeing is an attempt to substitute notions. Because this is not a question of whether the Kiev regime is allowed or not allowed to strike targets on Russian territory. It is already carrying out strikes using unmanned aerial vehicles and other means. But using Western-made long-range precision weapons is a completely different story.
The fact is that – I have mentioned this, and any expert, both in our country and in the West, will confirm this – the Ukrainian army is not capable of using cutting-edge high-precision long-range systems supplied by the West. They cannot do that. These weapons are impossible to employ without intelligence data from satellites which Ukraine does not have. This can only be done using the European Union’s satellites, or US satellites – in general, NATO satellites. This is the first point.
The second point – perhaps the most important, the key point even – is that only NATO military personnel can assign flight missions to these missile systems. Ukrainian servicemen cannot do this.
Therefore, it is not a question of allowing the Ukrainian regime to strike Russia with these weapons or not. It is about deciding whether NATO countries become directly involved in the military conflict or not.
If this decision is made, it will mean nothing short of direct involvement – it will mean that NATO countries, the United States, and European countries are parties to the war in Ukraine. This will mean their direct involvement in the conflict, and it will clearly change the very essence, the very nature of the conflict dramatically.
This will mean that NATO countries – the United States and European countries – are at war with Russia. And if this is the case, then, bearing in mind the change in the essence of the conflict, we will make appropriate decisions in response to the threats that will be posed to us.
( http://www.en.kremlin.ru/events/president/news/75092 )
Meanwhile, Russia has already said its response would include arming proxies against the West.
Note that the USN has not been able to stop the Houthis from shooting their limited missiles, so that for months the Southern port of Israel has been closed.
So what might it mean to Israel if Russia sent advanced hypersonic antiship missiles and its best AA missiles, manned by Russians, to Lebanon, Syria, Egypt, Iran, and/or the Houthis?
Israel and the US would attack and smash with wild abandon, but could they really do any better than they have against the Houthis? Than they did against Saddam's Scuds? (They lied about the Scuds, we now know that was a total failure.)
Israel embattled that way would fight hard, but it is not sustainable long term to have its sea access and commercial airspace closed to normal, safe traffic. They might not collapse militarily (but they might) however they would die economically. It would be the end of the Israeli economic miracle of which Netanyahu has boasted for decades. It would be like Britain during the Battle of the Atlantic, staggering economically.
Oh, and don't forget the flaming aircraft carriers of the USN if it gets too close for too long.
This is not a speculative response from Russia, because it is what they specifically said they would do.
Putin needs to send troops to Iran and to provide Iran with substantial arrays of AA missiles../.. Maybe even station some nukes there. Unfortunately, given the lack of thoughtful diplomacy, nothing provides better stability than a stalemate.
The thing is, though, we need to avert any possible escalation…
Russia is not going to put nukes in Iran. As for the Russian AA missiles, they have done that more than once in the past with other Arab countries. Other than the first few days of the 1973 war it has not turned out well for the Russian built AA systems. In 1982 Israel destroyed 29 of the 30 advance Russian built AA batteries in Syrian in one day. Just two Israel planes were damaged in the strikes. Also Israel destroyed 80+ Russian built warplanes that day.
You seem to be confusing Russia with the Soviet Union.
I have no particularly strong opinion on whether specific Russian weapons systems are better, worse, or pretty much the same as their Soviet equivalants, but you’re referring to two different countries, one of which used to rule the other but now no longer exists.
In other news, Zastava is no longer a Yugoslavian arms manufacturer.
too bad we shot down their hyperosnic missiles
The USA policy is to limited the Houthis firing at ships. Not to stop them. If the USA went all out to stop them, the USDA would have a no fly zone and mine the harbors. Nothing could be shipped into the Houthis controlled areas. Of course a lot a civilians would die from this blockade and the "genocide" chants would be in full swing.
As for Israel, people who make claims like you do seem to forget what Israel is capable of doing to the Palestinians. In your plans what would prevent Israel from cutting off food and water to Gaza? And what would prevent Israel from expelling the Palestinians from the West Bank? If one goes all out against Israel like you are hoping for they are going to go out after the Palestinians.
Moon of Alabama has a precis with link to Putin's statement. It's worth a look.
ON TO MOSCOW declares the west for the 3rd and last time!!!
Exactly. As Simplicius the Thinker writes on Substack, these weapons can only be aimed with certain high-tech keys, which the Western states will not hand over to a gangster state like Ukraine who could pass them on to the highest bidder. The weapons are handled by NATO officers. They just have a Ukrainian pull the trigger in the last moment.
Only a sub–IQ Ukrainian would wish to start World War III.
The totalitarian dictator Zelensky is so desperate he would do anything including striking deep into Russia to save his beacon from being toasted.
What would America do if Russia provided Venezuela with missiles capable of hitting Washington and New York?
What would America do if the technicians who were tasked with launching these missiles were all Russian "contractors"?
What would America do if targeting data from Russian satellites was provided to crews launching missiles toward Washington and New York?
What would America do if a stratagem was provided by the Russian FSB (CIA and MI6) to go ahead with attacks?
Place yourselves in the shoes of the Bear who has been pushed by America and NATO since 1990.
The ruling Zionist-Neocon elite is the most destructive force in history I know of. Compared to them the Nazis pale. They stop for nothing.
I agree. Except, is he really a Ukrainian? Would a real Ukrainian do what he did to his own country?
That strays into "No True Scotsman" territory, I fear.
Anyone, Zelenskiyy included, who claims to be "Ukrainian" is Ukrainian, unless reasonable, logical evidence disqualifies them.
Just yesterday on site I overheard a fellow claim that Canadian Federal NDP leader (and PM Trudeau coalition ally) Jagmeet Singh "is not a TRUE CANADIAN" because "yeah, he's a Canadian citizen" but "he wasn't born here" and/or "didn't grow up here". All of which is bulls**t.
I asked my toilet. My toilet told me it cares more about Ukraine than he does. It’s out of my hands. Sorry, Uncle.
All good.
One hopes there is less s**t coming out of your toilet than out of Ukrainian leadership.
LOL. I doubt it.
how does a toilet care more about ukraine than me
LOL. You talk to your toilet and it talks back??? What drugs are you using?
I AM A REAL UKRAINIAN IN LVIV
and Uncle Sapien is right that treads in to the "no true scotsman" territory
He is a greedy Ukrainian puppet of the US willing to do that to his country.
That's what the Biden-Harris administration wants: direct war with Russia and possibly also with China, North Korea, etc.
People who think that world wars are romantic are going to regret it when they will have to live the consequences.
Do you war with a caged bear? Nope, you poke it, tease it, torture it ,starve it but you never let it loose…
95% of the population have never lived during a world war, with rationing and price and wage controls.
People are not animals and this is no argument for war.
A)Humans are always warring, and we all suffer under the Cold War which has been going on since 45. Variations on a theme of 'King of the Hill" and who controls the world.
B) Humanity is a primate, a member of the ape family, a a mammal and hence an animal.
C) You stated that biden/harris want a world war is which incredibly, uhm, dumb.
War will continue as long as young fools pick up weapons and do the bidding of greedy idiots!
Most people don't want war, because they know that they and their children will pay the price.
But malicious politicians and their friends can take advantage of wars to enrich themselves at everyone's expense.
That's why they demonize the leaders of the countries they want to provoke into war.
And to provoke war, they will ressort to false flags operations, propaganda and lies.
The on going war in Ukraine has been planned after the collapse of the Soviet Union, in 1991. After the coup in Ukraine in 2014, all attempts to prevent war were sabotaged. That's an historic fact.
If most people dont want war then maybe they should Get up say no, and teach their children not be gullible and Join..If our kids dont go to war, then they cant use them to war,right?
1)The pioneers of a warless world are the young men (and women) who refuse military service.
Albert Einstein
2)”War will exist until that distant day when the conscientious objector enjoys the same reputation and prestige that the warrior does today” is a quote by John F. Kennedy.
We’re actually on the same page but im obviously older and less tolerable to excuses and bs…
Why do you think they love AI? It only takes a smaller batch of those willing to kill.
“The weapons of war must be abolished before they abolish us.“ John F. Kennedy, 35th U.S. President, 1961-1963, (in an address to the United Nations General Assembly, September 25, 1961).
There's conflict (and there always will be), but then there is war.
Defeatistism is no answer.
RUSSIA is not a "caged bear."
The only reason Russia feels caged is because they are a 2nd world country in a 1st world Europe.
If any of you Rusotards decide to move there, make sure you have real plumbing!
Only? Your lack of knowledge on history and current events is only exceeded by your rudeness, insulting and trite…
The U.S. has never suffered a real war on their territory although many liken 9/11 to a world war. Not even close. If the escalation continues and there is no reason to believe the crazed war mongering profiteers are going to stop, then the U.S. will most likely experience something that they have never experienced, and that being an attack on the continental U.S. Won't be a ground invasion but those submarines off the coast can inflict lots of damage in short order. D.C. is living in a fantasy world where the politicos believe they are immune to an attack.
American society will suffer greatly if electricity alone is destroyed.
"The U.S. has never suffered a real war on their territory" The revolutionary war and war of 1812 were indeed fought on USA territory.
Perhaps this is pedantic, but the "USA territory" didn't exist as such during the revolutionary war, nor was 1812 of such a scale as the OP is suggesting. The Civil War would have been a better counter-example.
Yes, I would agree that there were wars fought on native soil just as the Civil War was fought on American soil but just to be clear I’m speaking of a Global War such as has been experienced by Europe and the rest of the world with WW1 and WW2. The damage from the wars fought against Britain, Mexico and internal conflicts while deadly were limited which won’t be the case if we are attacked by a nation like Russia or China.
Why would they want that?
I disagree. Biden wants Ukraine to weaken Russia until the last Ukrainian is dead. When that happens, he will find another country, such as Georgia or one of the Baltic States, to carry the burden. He will use Taiwan against China, and possibly the Philippines and/or Pakistan. The last thing he wants is a direct war because he worries about American voters.
They tried Georgia first, and it failed. They succeeded in Ukraine in 2014.
They are 𝘴𝘵𝘪𝘭𝘭 trying in Georgia, and they aren’t finished with Belarus yet either.
"What would America do if Russia provided Venezuela with missiles capable of hitting Washington and New York?"
You illustrate, if perhaps indirectly, an excellent point :
The Russians (as with the USA in your Venezuela example) have no practical way to tell if a US- or UK-made missile was fired by Ukraine, or by the US or UK, against targets inside the Russian Federation.
By principles of self-defense (particularly nuclear defense) the Russian Federation has to assume, and reply accordingly, that any nuclear-capable US- or UK- or French-made missiles inbound on RF targets ARE IN FACT nuclear missiles inbound as a first-strike.
Otherwise, what stopped the USA (with Jupiter missiles in Turkey) or the USSR (with likewise nuclear-tipped missiles in Cuba) in the early '60s from launching a first-strike and expecting no retaliation ???
"WE didn't launch against you – TURKEY / CUBA did !!!"
Only a sub anything Russkie bot would want ww3
Zelenskyy is not a dictator and much less of a dictator than Putin.
Lol. "the bear that has been pushed since 1990." Make sure not to sh*t yourself while saying this.
Just cope harder that the future of Europe is not under a totalitarian dictatorship and that the west wants to choose its own fate.
Clearly you do need some more coping
F**k Russia
Death to the enemies of ukraine
DEATH TO RUSSIA
In every posting you make you prove the point made earlier. How embarrassing for you!
i have to defend against idiots like you
No defense can be found for that attitude as those comments prove the statement.
ok American
Pick up a map much?
Try being more polite! Are you about contributing to peace or ass holiness?!
Get your head out of your own ass!
Are you a Scorpio?… Astrologically speaking?…
My mama was a Scorpio and alls she did was fight all the live long day!
I am a Pisces and I can kick your ass around the Damn block! So put up or shut the hell up!
Before we goti nvaded people like you said that Russia would never invade us
On Feb. 25th you said that the west forced russia to do it
you people supporting russia are the reasons why I am ashamed to be a socialist, the endless soviet cope
UKRAINE WILL BE FREE
UKRAINE WILL BE INDEPENDENT
UKRAINE IS ALL I HAVE
ENTERNAL UKRAINE
HOLY
POWERFUL
GLORY TO THE PEOPLE
GLORY TO UKRAINE
Donna, take own advice.
Clearly you need more knowledge of our history with Russia since the early 1990's before there was a President Putin. Or you just don't care because it doesn't fit your favorite narrative. For an idea, check out the writings and videos of Jeffrey Sachs and Dr. Stephen Cohen.
yes 2 of the most pro rus people in the world
i’d rather trust Bandera
Of course you would.
Yup
I would
Slava Bandera
Gotcha. A known NS Germany collaborator responsible for the murder of “undesirables”.
Johnny atleast he fought for a state for us
You are someone who desperately needs attention, to your Self.
Cope harder the USSR is dead and will never come back
Слава україні
Героям слава
Смерть ворогам України!
Смерть русам!
Найвищий орден – це служба своїй країні!!!
Eff off bucko!
If you decide to move to russia tell us here if you manage to get working plumbing
Wow.
Don’t think I’ve seen you react this way.
Lol. "the bear that has been pushed since 1990." Make sure not to sh*t yourself while saying this.
You obviously didn't live through the 90's. Denying the bullying by the US almost immediatelly following the end of the cold war was obvious to anyone with an ounce of objectivity. Not to say the USSR wouldn't have acted in a similar way that the US did, but there is no denying the US' belligerence towards Russia. None.
You rock the truth for peace, wars!
WHat belligerence? Give an example
The big lie of "not once inch eastward" to start. Economically. Each president tries to outdo his predecessor. Trump bragged about being harder and imposing more sanctions on Russia than Obama, and he was right. And yet he was accused of being Putin's puppet. And this didn't start with them two. Each and every election cycle from way back our "two" parties bitch about the other party being weak on Russia. Depends which party is in office. Both parties' platforms always include promises of more belligerence towards Russia. And why do you think your country is currently being used as fodder?
At least you admit not 1 inch eastwards was a lie invented by Putin.
Our country is being used as fodder because Putin didn’t want to lose his last grasp of control over us because he knows Belarus on;y counts as 1/4 of a country to control
“Not 1 inch eastward” was the west’s promise years before Putin came to power.
nhuuhnh
You don't have to like the facts.
They're the facts whether you like them or not.
well then everyone on this website is wrong i’d say is a fair solution
This is an internet myth. There is nothing in writing that says NATO promised not to advance further after 1991.
Right. Meaning our spoken word isn't worth shit.
Washington D.C., December 12, 2017 – U.S. Secretary of State James Baker’s famous “not one inch eastward” assurance about NATO expansion in his meeting with Soviet leader Mikhail Gorbachev on February 9, 1990, was part of a cascade of assurances about Soviet security given by Western leaders to Gorbachev and other Soviet officials throughout the process of German unification in 1990 and on into 1991, according to declassified U.S., Soviet, German, British and French documents posted today by the National Security Archive at George Washington University ( http://nsarchive.gwu.edu ).
https://nsarchive.gwu.edu/briefing-book/russia-programs/2017-12-12/nato-expansion-what-gorbachev-heard-western-leaders-early#:~:text=Washington%20
Thank you for pre-labeling your Internet myth.
Your are correct. There was no treaty just a policy. And policies change with time.
You only want to argue and fight. I
think you are in the wrong place. Contribute something constructive or find your sorry ass banned!
I am contributive. More than you guys by a million
And I asked for an example of “american belligerence”
Not you to whine about my “contribution”
Look up the word PUTZ, in the dictionary, cause it says: See You!
Still waiting for the example of NATO belligerence
It was US belligerence. No US, no NATO. No sense of pretending.
ok. how?
I already replied to you as to "how". And you replied back. Are you slow?
Look up the word “russkie tankie” in dictionary: It says, see yoU!
Why is this person screaming on the internet when they can put blood and skin in the game by fighting Russians on the front lines?
They will take anyone. What is stopping them?
I just saw a promotion of Nazi Bandera. JFC
Now I know why I blocked.
Banning has nothing to with whether or not “contributions” are “constructive.”
So true.
Are my contributions constructive?
If you say yes I'll lend you a can of Horilka, its 40% alcohol
I only drank it once so far. Best eve'r
Your contributions aren’t any less “constructive” than most here.
so… bad?
Again take your own advice.
Why is this person screaming on the internet when they can put blood and skin in the game by fighting Russians on the front lines?
They will take anyone. What is stopping them?
I just saw a promotion of Nazi Bandera. JFC
Now I know why I blocked.
Western realists opposing Biden's Ukraine policies often say that Russia/Putin does not want to govern the hostile people of Western Ukraine. They say his territorial ambitions are limited to the Eastern regions where people are more friendly to Russia.
So what to do with the Western parts? NATO seems to imagine it as a sanctuary from which to run an insurgency, and ultimately as the larger part of Ukraine they'll get to take into NATO even if they lose the rest, perhaps with its capital in Lviv.
This expansion of the war gives Russia another option. They can make the regions around Lviv radioactive and uninhabited by a substantial nuclear strike. Problem solved, the West won't be there, and Russia need not govern it either.
NATO had best be more careful what they provoke — they may get it, and more of it than they'd wanted.
Would the US trade DC and NYC for Lviv? Would London commit suicide in outrage over Lviv? Would Paris? Nah. Deterrence is not credible, if they push it this far.
https://simplicius76.substack.com/p/zelenskys-last-hail-mary-gets-off
"Of course, now there’s talk of JASSM missiles, and the above is merely the underscoring of the point I had made several articles ago where I stated that JASSMs do not represent some “new” wunderwaffe ability but rather the desperate measure of carrying over Ukrainian strike capability from the depleted ATACMS. The JASSMs are much cheaper, at reportedly $700k or so, and on top of that, the US has far more of them in stock—supposedly in the several thousands."
A fantastic analysis of a very dangerous point in world history.
One can only speculate about the sanity and IQ of certain Ukrainians who would visit the extinction of humans on earth to wet their hatred of Russia.
Or Russia can take his army out of Ukraine and no extinction of humans on earth will happen.
Donald J. Trump
@realDonaldTrump
24m
Russia has today threatened to use Nuclear Weapons, and we have Low IQ individuals, the same that messed up Afghanistan (who don’t have a clue!), in charge of this deadly situation. NO GOOD — NOT ACCEPTABLE!!! MAGA2024
And you want to replace him with a person suffering from FTD dementia. It is clearly on display with Trump. Just watch how he acts.
LOL. You should have Trump’s “dementia” and his energy.
Wouldn’t wish that on anyone. Sad!
What’s so bad or sad about being rich and successful?
What’s so “successful” about inheriting $400 million and, decades later, having less of it left after your various scams and business failures than if you had just stuck it in an S&P 500 indexed mutual fund?
Unlike Trump I can remember what I said just a few days ago. And unlike Trump I don't lapse into a world of make believe. Pay attention to some of the things he says and believes. They are insane. These are the first signs of FTD where one flips from normal to crazy back and forth.
Wish folks would start linking to Iran’s Press TV, all in English now!…
We really need a wider category on this, I believe..
https://www.presstv.ir/Live
Historically it did not. In the modern fantasy land ‘history’ of contemporary Ukraine it seems it does.
mhm
How would a nuclear war between Russia and the US affect you personally?
Only a Ukrainian with nothing more than hatred in their limited mind will push for this outcome.
What would happen if a nuclear war were to be sparked between Russia and the United States today?
Who would survive? In our most scientifically realistic simulation to date, we show what a nuclear war between Russia and the United States might look like today. It is based on detailed modeling of nuclear targets, missile trajectories, and the effects of blasts, EMPs, and smoke on the climate and food resources.
1. After one side launches nuclear missiles, the other will strike back before the missiles even reach their target.
2. First strikes are high-frequency electromagnetic pulses that knock out electronics and power grids.
3. Subsequent strikes hit command centers, missile silos, and megacities.
4. The blasts create fireballs that destroy everything around them, causing blast waves that destroy buildings.
5. The UK and France are also hit because of NATO commitments.
6. Nuclear winter covers the Earth, causing freezing cold even in summer.
7. 5 billion people could starve to death, including 99% of the population of the US, Europe, Russia and China.
There are no winners in a nuclear war, only losers.
Why do you hate Ukraine so much? Did you get molested by them as a child? or Did your Ukrainian boy friend never called back? Are you angry Putin cannot play a piano with tiny penis?
Wow, another racist, homophobe, and hater of President Putin with a fixation of male appendages.
How’s the world under that tin foil hat?
There are no winners in a total nuclear exchange. Just a lot of dead and dying people.
Stop targeting me f-in Russkie pig
And you're right. I am full of hatred
Full of hatred for the evil beast that has killed my family and friends
FUll of hateful for the beast that rains terror on my country
Russia is a stain on this planet that does not deserve to exist
Then pick up a gun and join the battle. Instead you hide behind your student status and stay safely out of the fight, letting other men die. Keyboard warrior. The Russians are men. You are a coward.
In 10 months
The crisis for Ukraine is now. Your studies can wait. Ukraine needs you at Pokrovsk. But your ass and your career are more important to you than Ukraine. And you prove that every minute you stay in the class room and let other men die so you can stay safe and have a career.
yapyapyapyap
Patriotism is the last refuge of a scoundrel.
I bet you are one those million of Russian menkeyboard warrior that fled the country to avoid going to fight in Ukraine.
Nope. I’m an American who served in the Army (infantry).
You see, Ukrainian cowards hiding outside of Ukraine have nothing in common with American combat veterans who have been in a war zone.
With lower IQs and an insane hatred of Russia, to the point that they would push for nuclear war and the extinction of humans on earth, they are evil.
Clean, clear and crisp! Truth works for me!
Have you seen a psychiatrist recently. Paranoia and anger management seem to run deep, and perhaps psychotic behavior is near at hand.
When a Rorschach inkblot is seen are people observed targeting you? Do you see nefarious Russians around every corner?
Please get some help before you act on violent psychotic behavior driven by insane hatred of Slavic Russians.
I dont see nefarious russians around every corner I only see them in the land of the Rus
And I have seen therapist I should be OK
Kievan Rus'. Time to regather the Russian lands.
kyivan rus’ was Ukrainian. Don’t know if you noticed the Kyivan part.
Ukraine as a notion didn't exist in the days of Kievan Rus'.
it did
Knew it by your own admission you “have seen therapist “.
I rest my case for your paranoia and psychosis.
it was once
and if you mock someone because they see a therapist that is ridiculously low and genuinly cruel
Not castigating for past psychotic and paranoid issues, merely noticing an ongoing mental problem which needs mental help.
Please seek psychiatric care before it drives you mad.
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GKrQ7W5W0AAzqeq?format=jpg&name=small
https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/2169fde717b00a7506d2c5beb91af07761f2c3c92f8c720df9aabeeb4850c70b.jpg
Unhappy British clown meet the American clowns. The British clowns leave with a frown when told "No means No"!
No targeting data from America for the British Clowns.
Now the few insane low IQ Ukrainians, who run their mouths incessantly, can spin in the wind.
Keir Starmer intends to discuss the West's strategy in Ukraine again with Joe Biden at the end of September, The Daily Telegraph.
Today we had the opportunity to discuss not only this or that specific step or tactic, but also the strategy concerning Ukraine, and also to discuss in detail the situation in the Middle East and other regions. We need to be able to discuss this with our allies.
We will have another opportunity to do this in a week at the UN General Assembly session, and we will take advantage of it,
— the British Prime Minister said.
The publication draws attention to the fact that following the meeting of the leaders, neither Washington nor London announced a decision to strike deep into Russian territory with high-precision Western missiles.
https://www.rt.com/russia/604016-us-hide-nuclear-war-antonov/
US can’t hide from nuclear war – Moscow
Such a conflict won’t have winners or losers, Russian Ambassador to the US Anatoly Antonov has said
https://sputnikglobe.com/20240915/biden-starmer-fail-to-agree-on-ukraines-long-range-strikes-against-russia–1120160476.html
I believe Biden has given Lloyd Austin and Keir Starmer the go-ahead for nuclear escalation.
The sheer insanity of the US and UK is quite revealing. Neither country would dare face the Russians in Ukraine directly because both countries are "paper tigers", and would be crushed. The only saving hand the US would have is nukes since they do not win conventional war's.
Stopping this conflict is the only way forward, and if Trump can do it he has my vote. The death cult called the Democratic Party is utterly worthless and proves by the day that they hate Americans and the country as a whole.
https://korybko.substack.com/p/what-would-really-be-achieved-by?utm_source=post-email-title&publication_id=835783&post_id=148914668&utm_campaign=email-post-title&isFreemail=true&r=5350k&triedRedirect=true&utm_medium=email
What Would Be Achieved By Russia Using Nuclear Weapons In Ukraine At This Point?
I agree with Andrew except to ask, why would Russia use nuclear weapons in Ukraine? Perhaps I'm accusing him of sophomore analysis.
It's one consideration when considering prevailing west-to-east wind air flows or the radiation moving into Russia. Another is farmland contamination of unknown duration in western Ukraine. Most of that land mass is destined to become part of Novorossiya.
If peace with Europe, ex the UK, Brussels, and Celigny, Switzerland is to be realized, a nuclear exchange doesn't lend credence. The negative attitude of Europeans toward Russians is well documented. Germans may be the exception.
How strongly do citizens of Europe and BRICS countries despise Washington and the WEF? In Europe's case, is it sufficient to murder the political elite of the 28-member bloc?
I suggest, however incorrectly, that Washington and the UK will be the main targets of Russian nuclear missiles.
There are no winners per se in a conventional war. There are no winners in a nuclear war if we believe the pundits.
The WEF may be leaning toward the Kremlin to perform its dirty work. The Russians have a peace argument. A strike on American soil might improve the various conditions for Palestinians.
It feels like a dead-man's switch is being constructed whereby if the wrong people take power it goes off and kills everyone, and if the right people remain in power it can be defused (hopefully) at the last second.
It leaves me with the distinct impression that all our lives are being gambled with by gambling addicts.
"Putin: Supporting Long-Range Strikes on Russian Territory Would Put NATO ‘at War With Russia’"
Translation – the Kremlin will do what it has always don, which is complain like crybabies and make silly threats of using nukes that no one takes seriously.
Cause and Effect or in the more plebeian F@#k Around and Find Out FAFO!
The principle of causation!
"the post-Cartesian attempt to see everything as governed by simple laws of cause and effect" the operation or relation of a cause and its effect.
"cause and effect play an important part in the universe"
The British are pushing hard to allow use of use Storm Shadow munitions to attack into Russia proper. The British, Canada, Sweden, Finland, and the Baltic principalities are in favor. Italy, France, and Spain are opposed to strikes into Russia.
England is now surrounded by a half dozen Russian submarines armed with conventional hypersonic missiles.
Thinking is that the British military manufacturing facilities could be targeted if Britain attacks Russia.
But NATO is at war with Russia since the start of his war.
Is Putin bluffing again?