Tel Aviv carried out several attacks across the Gaza Strip this weekend. On Saturday, Gaza’s Health Ministry said more than 100 Palestinians were killed, along with 169 others wounded, in 24 hours amid various strikes. This was the deadliest day in the Strip since the June 8 massacre on the Nuseirat refugee camp, which slaughtered at least 274 Palestinians and wounded hundreds more. A UN facility was hit on Sunday, killing at least four people.
On Friday, the IDF bombarded areas in southern Gaza near the International Committee of the Red Cross (ICRC) base at the al-Mawasi camp, a location Tel Aviv claimed was a safe zone for displaced Palestinians following its invasion of Rafah. Palestinian officials say two Israeli strikes killed a minimum of 25 people and wounded 50 others, the Associated Press reported. The victims were among hundreds of Palestinians sheltering in tents outside the ICRC office.
Witnesses whose family members were slaughtered in the bombing told AP that the IDF fired a second volley that killed people making their way out of their tents. The ICRC denounced the mass killing at the camp and noted the warring parties were aware of the location of its humanitarian office, which was also struck during the attack.
“Firing so dangerously close to humanitarian structures, of whose locations the parties to the conflict are aware and which are clearly marked with Red Cross emblems, puts the lives of civilians and Red Cross staff at risk,” an ICRC statement reads. It added, “The strike damaged the structure of the ICRC office, which is surrounded by hundreds of displaced civilians living in tents, including many of our Palestinian colleagues.”
A day later, Al Jazeera documented further assaults on the al-Mawasi camp with Tareq Abu Azzoum, one of the outlet’s correspondents on the ground, reporting “Witnesses said Israeli tanks carried out a sudden and unexpected incursion in al-Mawasi, launching a number of artillery shells towards the evacuation centers and makeshift tents… The entire area of al-Mawasi is an evacuation center. It’s a very tiny strip of land where more than 100,000 Palestinians have been taking refuge. It’s the place where field hospitals have been established and it’s a center for humanitarian organizations.”
In northern Gaza, on Saturday, at least 43 more Palestinians were murdered by Israeli attacks on the Shati refugee camp as well as Gaza City’s Tuffah neighborhood. Abu Azzoum said a residential area in the Shati refugee camp was targeted, another location where displaced Palestinians from the north were told they could seek refuge.
“Rescuers with the help of civilians are trying to sift through the rubble to find survivors… The casualties arriving at Al-Aqsa hospital are surging,” he said. The head of Gaza’s Government Media Office told the outlet that, in Shati, 24 people were killed in 7 homes. Gaza’s Civil Defense reported recovering 19 bodies from Tuffah.
On Sunday, eight Palestinians were killed and multiple others wounded in Gaza City near an aid center, sheltering hundreds of people, that was the primary headquarters of the UN agency for Palestinian refugees (UNRWA) in the besieged enclave. The air strike hit the compound’s main gate. This facility is used to distribute the miniscule amount of aid that reaches the Strip.
According to UNRWA, since the start of the Gaza onslaught, 188 UN facilities have been targeted during 445 Israeli bombing raids killing more than 500 displaced Palestinians and wounding more than 1,500. Additionally, the IDF has murdered a record 193 UN workers.
In an X post, the IDF took credit for the “precise strike” on the UNRWA aid center but blamed Hamas and Islamic Jihad, claiming it has become a base of their operations without providing evidence.
Over the last several days, Israeli tanks have advanced further into the western and northern parts of Rafah, with the southern Gazan city’s residents saying the pace of Israeli operations is accelerating. Reuters reports the IDF is moving toward a complete capture of the city, where approximately 1.5 million Palestinians had been displaced throughout the first seven months of the genocidal war.
More than a million people have been displaced from Rafah since the IDF seized the vital Rafah border crossing with Egypt on May 7 and subsequently destroyed it, deliberately exacerbating the already catastrophic humanitarian crisis caused by the massive bombing campaign and its concomitant starvation siege. The director of Gaza’s Kamal Adwan Hospital said Saturday that four children starved to death this week. “We lost a child in the nursery department of the hospital during the past few hours. He is the fourth child to die in the hospital in the last week due to malnutrition,” he told a news conference.
“We’ve seen massive displacement over the last weeks and months, and we know that combination and the heat can cause a rise in diseases,” the World Health Organization’s (WHO) Richard Peeperkorn warned. “We have water contamination because of hot water, and we will have much more food spoilage because of the high temperature. We will get insect mosquitoes and flies, dehydration, heat stroke.” The WHO has demanded the Rafah border crossing be reopened to facilitate aid shipments as well as permit the medical evacuation of at least 10,000 wounded and maimed Palestinians requiring treatment abroad.
During an interview with Punchbowl News, Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu declared Israel is not purposely killing or starving civilians in Gaza, calling the allegation a “blood libel against the Jewish people.” Since October, the IDF has slaughtered 37,598 Palestinian Muslims and Christians, including 15,000 children, and over 86,000 more have been wounded. The UN says the IDF has destroyed more than half of all buildings in Gaza. Beneath that rubble, at least 10,000 Palestinians are said to be missing or presumed dead.
Connor Freeman is the assistant editor and a writer at the Libertarian Institute, primarily covering foreign policy. He is a co-host on the Conflicts of Interest podcast. His writing has been featured in media outlets such as Antiwar.com, Counterpunch, and the Ron Paul Institute for Peace and Prosperity. He has also appeared on Liberty Weekly, Around the Empire, and Parallax Views. You can follow him on Twitter @FreemansMind96.
the IDF has slaughtered 37,598 Palestinian
Keep in mind that number is only those who died in a hospital or were confirmed dead in a morgue. Considering the state of the medical system in Gaza most of the few medical facilities still functioning don't have the time or staff to file reports. That's why the numbers have pretty much plateaued, not because the IDF has stopped killing people.
Estimates of the actual number of dead run from 100,000 to 200,000.
And what percentage is actual Hamas?
Considering municipal workers like utility linemen and such had to join Hamas, about 1.5%. People who actually carried a gun were something like 20% of that.
Let's do the math. Start with your high figure of 200,000. 1.5 % of 200,000 is 3,000 members of Hamas killed. 20% of 3000 is 600. Now the war has been going on for 260+ days. Just to make the math easy, let use 250 days. 600 divided by 250 equals 2.4. If one starts out with the more probable number of 100,000. The Hamas fighters losses fall to 1.2 per day.
So with 1000s of heavy bombs dropped, 10,000s of 155 mm shells fired, who knows how many tank rounds fired, plus a million bullets fired, the IDF is only killing 1 to 3 Hamas fighters per day. That does not add up.
So you think the civilian death count is higher than 200,000?
Most of them. Look at the doctor who was holding hostages in his home. If you commit an act of war, you get war.
Actually, nothing is "confirmed;" the number is from Hamas, not known for telling the truth, and it likely includes at least 15,000 militants.
200,000? So, 10% of the population? That isn't the least bit credible.
Considering that they’ve dropped more bombs and missiles on Gaza in the first three months than London, Dresden, and Hamburg **combined** received in all of WWII, and Gaza was never allowed by the IDF to construct civilian bomb shelters, it doesn’t seem unreasonable.,
Also turning humans, largely women and children, the elderly and male civilians into numbers belies the depravity of methods. The barbarism of burning and burying people alive, of forcefully abandoning infants in incubators to perish and rot, of mocking suffering, of delighting in torture like forcing hot metal rods into prisoners’ rectums, in using aid as a trap to shoot starving people. In using a pier to secret murderous commandos to slaughter more families in a cynical trojan horse operation. In rapes. In killing their own forces to accomadate propaganda. And framing it all within some religious biblical supremacy right.
Numbers are not enough to demonstrate the sadistic sickness.
Genocide Joe did this.
He sent the weapons, and protected their use, knowing just exactly what would happen.
The man checked out years ago. Blame his puppeteers.
He would have done it when he was still senile. Those puppeteers are only making sure Joe does what Joe wants to do.
He has checked out,but still very shrewd.
And your Trump boy is going to make things better how?
Why do you think everybody that thinks genocide Joe is a piece of shit backs Trump? I have yet to hear Mark say anything that would make you think Trump is "his boy".
Simple, it is a binary race. Either Joe will win or the convict felony Trump will win.
Your inability to count candidates doesn’t magically make non-supporters of one of the two you acknowledge, supporters of the other.
Knapp answered for me. And here I was going to call you fucking stupid again. Oh well.
It might provide the impetus to purge the Israel-Firsters from the Democratic party. Especially if he goes whole-hog on supporting Israel.
The photos and stories are devastating. The little girl who searches for her lost arm in rubble, she can’t play with any toys or do all things she used to. The severed head of a very young child collected in a blanket. The child wishing a bag of flour for the doctor tending to her care, and all she said she wanted was water. It’s all beyond heartbreaking and barbaric.
Never again. Never again. Never again.
Israeli military promises investigation after forces accused of using man as a 'human shield'
Photo:
https://acquiaprod.middleea…
https://acquiaprod.middleea…
If only John Dillinger knew – all he had to do was blame Hamas. Then he could have robbed banks with impunity.
No analogy whatsoever!
Yeah, if John Dillinger blamed Hamas he wouldn't have had to rob banks. The Federal Government would have shoveled tax dollars straight into his pockets!
And you think that was an analogy? I'm pretty sure it was laced heavily with sarcasm.
Imagine being a US congressman and knowing that in less than a month you will be filmed for posterity jumping out of your seat at least 50 times to give this Netanyahoo butcher of 17,000 children a thunderous hero's welcome to Capitol Hill. All because AIPAC owns you and you know it. What a legacy to leave for history.
"The Israeli military is working toward a complete capture of Rafah, while attacking International Red Cross and UN humanitarian sites throughout Gaza" No problem. This is exactly why we support Israel.
When a terrorist group like Hamas does not separate fighters from civilians, Israel can either give up or fight. Fighting present a higher chance of surviving. The UN is clearly a joke with zero credibility, especially after they changed the rules to create hereditary refugee status, which never existed before.
(According the UN definition and every conflict in history, a refugee is someone who flees a conflict; it does not include a grandchildren or great-grandchildren of refugees. For some reason, the UN only provides this special status to refugees from the Arab-Israeli conflict – not to refugees from India, Pakistan, Kashmir, or countless other conflicts. This absurd status quo has to stop).
"Palestine refugees are not distinct from other refugees in protracted refugee situations such as those from Afghanistan or Somalia, where there are multiple generations of refugees, registered by UNHCR as refugees and supported as such. Protracted refugee situations are the result of the failure to find political solutions to their underlying political crises."
https://www.unrwa.org/transfer-refugee-status-descendants-unique-unrwa-0
Every fu-king day I wake up to another mass murder in Gaza. This has to stop!
Almost six months ago the bullshit ICJ heard evidence and issued three orders begging Israel pretty please to stop the slaughter. The world governments have abandoned the Palestinians. Only the United States can stop the genocide. But only the American people can force our government to end the support of the Zionist genocide.
We did it for Vietnam. Now we have to do it for Palestine.
Yea, and it’s an uphill battle. You have fake protesters, who probably rope in some who are sincere, who do bad things which make defenders of Palestinians appear complicit and bad.
“Activists” will block traffic and bother others. How does this help? If they block an ambulance, injury or death could result.
Similarly, eco-terrorists, who are really just funded by billionaires and ngos, destroy heritage sites in Europe in the name of stopping oil or whatever. Such people don’t help their causes.
So, to defend Palestine, what’s needed is to counter and suppress the bad activists.
But the “from the river” phrase sometimes does suggest kicking out Israelis. The appeal that would work would call for tolerating all there. I don’t know if there are enough resources for all to live in the region, but few would support driving out Israelis.
First if all, why would Americans want to help Palestinians? They have sided with America's enemies for generations.
They backed the Nazis in WWII, sending troops to fight in the SS. The Grand Mufti of Jerusalem – the future mentor of Yasser Arafat – was a big support of Hitler and personally met with him. They also supported the Soviets in the Cold War and Saddam Hussein in the Gulf War. Palestinian Sirhan Sirhan murdered Bobby Kennedy for supporting Israel, and they cheered when Bin Laden attacked the WTC on 9/11.
The Palestinians need to find someplace to go. They lost the war in 1947-48, and pretending they won isn't working for them.
Why would we want to help them? Because some people actually have empathy and concern for the 2 million people who are suffering, and only a fool would believe that all of those people deserve this.
If we don't raise objections and try to stop this, it will be us tomorrow.
Nope. First of all, the majority of people in Gaza support Hamas. Second, the distinction between soldier and civilian is very blurry; look at the doctor and his community that held three hostages. This doctor supported the aims of a militant group that murders and kidnaps civilians; the doctor held civilians as hostages; and the doctor kept these hostages around his family and other women and children – knowing that they were a likely military target. Yet, when the expected hostage rescue occurs – suddenly he and everyone else is an innocent civilian. Really? You fall for that?
The majority of those killed are women and children. I guess, in your eyes, children are guilty of everything.
Also, you fail to understand the history and what grievances the Palestinians have, which are never addressed. As we have seen over the years, the settlers provoke and take more land and homes. That's just one part of the story, but people like you think historical events happen in vacuums.
Nonsense. First of all, we have no idea who has died, over than unreliable Hamas figures. Second, Hamas forced women and children to remain in buildings as human shields (while they hid safely underground) – knowing that a violent attack on Israel would result in a violent response. Hamas made no attempt to separate combatants and civilians.
As for the history, what "grievances" are you referring to?
First, various Muslim empires did not allow Jews to move to the area or buy land. It wasn't until the Ottoman left and the British took over that things changed.
In 1947, when the Palestinians were offered a partition plan – they responded by violence. When you say you'll settle the issue by war, you can't say "just kidding" when you lose.
The Palestinians continued to wage war on Israelis. They continued to lose. People who lose wars don't get "grievances".
And calling Israelis "settlers" is inaccurate. Many of Israel's leaders were born in Mandatory Palestine, while PLO head Yasser Arafat was born in Egypt, to an Egyptian family. Yet, you would claim that the people whose families have been in Israel for centuries are "settlers," while Arafat – an Egyptian citizen – was entitled to their country. Nonsense.
And look at Israel's main city – Jerusalem. They have had a Jewish majority since the 1850s. Yet, you think those people are "settlers"? Nope.
Your lame talking points no longer have power. You'll have to report back to the troll army and ask for better ones.
https://www.mintpressnews.com/212503-2/212503/
https://www.nytimes.com/202…
https://www.aljazeera.com/n…
The US shouldn’t have been involved in WWII, nor in Iraq; and the Cold War was stupid.
It sounds like they’ve been against you but not America. America should be neutral.
I see…so, after Japan attacked Pearl Harbor, and Nazi Germany declared war on the United States and started sinking our ships…you think the appropriate response would be, "Oh well, what's the big deal?"
And opposing the Soviet Union and its desire to rain nuclear bombs on the United States was "stupid"?
As for being neutral…that's not a luxury we can always enjoy. Sometimes the alternative is death.
The US knew of Japan’s attack in advance and allowed it to happen. The US provoked Japan and should have stayed out.
Germany didn’t want war with the US. The Soviet Union wouldn’t have acquired nukes without US traitors.
The problem with everything here is intervention. Had the US remained neutral, there would have been no war. The US chose to get involved.
Rosevelt feared German technologic skills,andunderetimated Japan. Germany declared war on the US,not vice versa.Refusing to sell war materials to Japan was a right decision,not a provocation.
Germany very much didn’t want war with both the US and Britain. It’s amazing you don’t know that.
Nazi Germany followed Hitler's views; it was an explicit dictatorship, where all decisions were based on one man.
Hitler wanted to conquer as much of the world as possible to create an empire. He made allies or enemies of countries purely based on expediency – such as the pact with Stalin, followed by the invasion of the USSR.
Britain was a threat to his power, and so was the United States. He was willing to make deals but had well-developed plans to invade Britain and would have destroyed America at some point, as he made clear in his "Second Book" (Zweites Buch).
https://en.wikipedia.org/wi…
Hitler was a Nordicist. His ideology was based on US supremacist ideology which saw US northwest Europeans as superior. This was a bad ideology, because Germany isn’t necessarily fully Nordic, though parts are very Nordic. Slavs and Mediterraneans are both excluded from the identity.
He wanted good relations with Britain and the US. Believe it or not.
He would have done better if respecting Slavs better, as I understand him anyway.
1. Proof that the US "knew" about the planned attack on Pearl Harbor?
2. The US "provoked" Japan?
3. Germany declared war on the United States; that usually means someone wants war.
4. The USSR acquired nuclear weapons because they wanted nuclear weapons. How is not the issue.
5. The US remained neutral in WWII until attacked; however, if the US had not helped the USSR, Germany would have likely defeated them, and the UK, and they would have acquired the nuclear weapons and jets they were working on. At that point, it would be too late to fight them. The US would be whatever the Germans and Japanese wanted us to be. Considering the violence, abuse, and slave labor in occupied countries, I don't think you would have liked the 1950s and 1960s in occupied America, especially if it was carpeted with nuclear bombs.
I’m not just an annoying right winger who makes this site look bad by association. I also read and use the site:
https://original.antiwar.com/justin/2012/12/06/pearl-harbor-roosevelt-knew/
Hitler wanted good relations with the US and Western Europe. He blamed Jews for why that didn’t happen.
I’m not sure there were any good guys in WWII, but I doubt Germany could have won. Maybe Switzerland was good.
Keep in mind that Hitler’s ideology came from the US. It also didn’t even make sense being applied in Germany. Germans as a whole are borderline in that identity , and he alienated kin neighbors. Supposedly, he was influenced by Jews, “master” instead of “chosen,” but I don’t really know.
I’ve also read that his ideas were outdated. In the past you wanted to take your neighbors’ land and resources, and you wanted to force others to do manual labour, but the world had changed.:
*Germany could have remained smaller and simply developed via mechanization and grown powerful without expansion.*
This is just what people have said. I’ve also read that the Soviets encouraged war in the West, wanted to conquer the weakened West. I’m uncertain.
As for Hitler's views "making sense," hating one people never makes sense, and he was clearly insane.
Hitler openly and explicitly based his racial views in part on the American “eugenics” mania.
Yes, but he extended these theories from the field of genetics to politics, claiming that certain political systems (specifically those of the USSR and USA) were both equally tainted by the genetic character of one "race", and that these systems could only be replaced by a system created by a superior "race".
The US certainly extended those theories into politics as well. Eugenics was behind the movement to require government “birth certificates” in the US, for the express purpose of preventing “miscegenation.” In some states, those deemed “mentally defective” were sterilized to prevent them from reproducing. Etc.
Yes, the US was very active in the eugenics field, including forced sterilizations and other barbaric practices. In fact, the the Rockefeller Foundation supported eugenics work by Dr. Josef Mengele at one point.
But what I was referring to is Hitler's view that political theory was dictated by the genetics of "inferior people". He claimed that the USSR, for example, was inferior because it had been conceived and implemented by "inferior people". This was applying eugenics theory to entire societies.
It's why he felt that certain "races" should be excluded from politics, as their DNA made them inherently a "threat" to Germany, and why is was justified – even necessary – to destroy other societies.
To explain one thing about my views that might help you:
I doubt some of the claims of what bad guys did during WWII. So, while I’m open to the possibility of certain people and states having done evil, I suspect there is bias in what we’re told about the crimes.
That doesn’t relate directly to your comment, but it might help explain why I wish we’d been neutral.
US isolationlism pre WWII failed. Swiss neutrality -really great.
Oh no. It never failed. The US just managed to not only provoke Japan but also to allow it to attack.
It depends on what you mean by crimes, evil, and bad guys.
“First if all, why would Americans want to help Palestinians? They have sided with America’s enemies for generations.”
Some of them have, some of them haven’t.
Just like Jews.
I thought you were an anarchist. Why should the US support anyone?
You thought correctly.
It shouldn't.
What does any of that have to do with your racism, though?
"My racism"? That is completely false. I support all my positions with facts, and no facts support the concept of racial superiority, which is the foundation of a racist worldview.
I suggest that you demonstrate any racist statements that I have made; failing that, you should apologize.
Sorry if the word "racism" bothers you as a descriptor for your clearly and unambiguous prejudices in favor of one ethno-religious group and against another ethnic group. I admit that it's imprecise.
It's not a question of precision in language, it's one of meaning.
I have presented various facts, including historical background that can contribute to discussions. If the facts are not accurate, then others are free to post alternative views.
It's also especially ludicrous considering that the vast majority of comments here clearly and unambiguously favor one ethno-religious group over another, often based on clearly inaccurate information.
The current conflict is very complex. Many of my posts simply respond to inaccurate statements that are made. As moderator, I would assume you would seek balanced discussions.
So, if the point of discussions is to share facts that support various points of view, I will continue to post verifiable facts from reliable sources. If the purpose of the discussions is to do exactly what you accuse me of doing – supporting one group in a conflict – then I would stop, as I'd just be wasting my time.
“As moderator, I would assume you would seek balanced discussions.”
You would assume incorrectly. As a moderator, my job is to enforce the site’s guidelines. Nothing more, nothing less, and nothing else. “Balance” isn’t part of those guidelines. Nor is my agreement or disagreement with a comment.
You said that your guidelines forbid "slurs or supremacist claims based on race, ethnicity, nationality, religion, disability, sex, sexual orientation or gender identity."
Have any of my comments violated the site guidelines?
Oh please. First of all, the United States doesn't support "the Jews". The US government supports Israel, which is designated a major non-NATO ally.
https://www.state.gov/u-s-security-cooperation-with-israel/#:~:text=Israel%20has%20been%20designated%20as,relationship%20with%20the%20United%20States.
Further, the question was, why support a group whose leaders are opposed to US interests? So, your answer is that the US should support the Palestinians – who seek to destroy a US ally – despite generations of leaders who support for US enemies – because of "some Jews".
You seem to be replying to someone else.
And to something other than what was said.
"This has to stop" Here is an idea. Have a Hamas surrender. How do you think the killing of Japanese stopped in 1945. They surrendered.
"
And you think if Hamas doesn't surrender that that justifies Israel ongoing slaughter. You like to blame anything and everything for Israel's decision to outdo the designated terrorist group with terrorism unmatched by ANY designated terrorist group.
Hamas started this battle on Oct 7. Hamas chose the battle space. And the simple fact that you don't understand that civilians die in urban combat. You have this video game view of war. War is ugly. Innocent people die. You want to stop that, stop the war. As long as Hamas holds Israel citizens, Israel will not stop. The best thing for people of Gaza is for Hamas to surrender. But Hamas leaders don't care.
Also, Hamas clearly had part of its strategy that women and children would die, as they knew the response Israel would make to the mass murder of their citizens, and that of weak Westerners.
However, Hamas hides out in tunnels, with plenty of food, clean water, and medicine, while the women and children are left to face the consequences of their actions unprotected. This was their plan and their goal.
Amazing how you know so many so called facts about hamas, their plans, how they live and eat. Unfortunately you don't know anything, just hasbra from your zionist pals.
You can call it anything you want, but that conclusion is obvious.
What else did they think would happen after they brutally slaughtered 1,200 Israelis, some in the most brutal way possible?
What do you think would happen after any nation was attacked in such a brutal terrorist attack? What did the United States do? What would you do if your neighbor slaughtered your entire family, including babies? Please explain how you would respond.
As for my Zionist pals, they are doing fine. They live in a country that defends its people. You wouldn't understand what that's like.
First the slain include a lot more soldiers and a lot fewer kids than the Hasbara would have us believe. https://www.timesofisrael.com/14-kids-under-10-25-people-over-80-up-to-date-breakdown-of-oct-7-victims-we-know-about/
Still 764 Civilians killed is still 764 too many.
However when the US responded to almost 3000 of its people killed on 9/11 it didn't slaughter 20,000-30,000 women and children in 8 months. The raw numbers are not even close and most civilians killed were directly targeted by the Taliban (don't forget the country was in the middle of a civil war when the US invaded) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Civilian_casualties_in_the_war_in_Afghanistan_(2001%E2%80%932021)
Also October 7th is only "unprovoked" if you ignore operation cast lead, pillar of cloud, and protective edge (I'm probably missing a couple but everyone not drinking the Hasbara Kool-Aid gets the idea) https://www.btselem.org/press_releases/20160720_fatalities_in_gaza_conflict_2014
https://www.btselem.org/gaza_strip/20121204_yael_stein_oped
https://statistics.btselem.org/en/stats/during-cast-lead/by-date-of-incident?section=overall&tab=overview
Finally you're Zionist pals don't seem to be doing so well; even the best Hasbara can't stop a bullet https://www.france24.com/en/middle-east/20240619-israeli-army-urgent-need-troops-amid-rising-casualties-in-gaza
And it doesn't bode well for the future that not many people under 50 are believing your propaganda anymore and that each year there are fewer and fewer boomers. https://www.pewresearch.org/short-reads/2024/04/02/younger-americans-stand-out-in-their-views-of-the-israel-hamas-war/
1. Yes, the slaughter of entire communities of civilians was bad.
2. Estimates of the total number dead from the "War on Terror" in response to 9/11 are in the millions.
https://responsiblestatecraft.org/2023/05/16/the-war-on-terror-led-to-over-4-5-million-deaths-report/
3. The Oct. 7 attack was during a time when Israel was leaving Gaza alone, but you are offering justifications for the slaughter of civilians; would you feel the same way if your family was snuffed out by Mexicans, American Indians, the descendants of enslaved people, Hawaiians, Germans, Japanese, Afghans, Iraqis, or other people who suffered at the hands of Americans?
4. Yes, Israelis a fighting for, and dying for, their people. You wouldn't understand.
5. Misinformed young people don't control US foreign policy; geopolitical reality does. Israel is a "major non-NATO ally" with nuclear weapons, and they provide advanced military, medical, and computer technology to the US, so the basic equation of geopolitics isn't going to change.
Yes because the US killing Native Americans in the 19th century is exactly the same as Israel bombing Gaza 15-10 years ago (or 5 years ago if you want to count the massacres during the 2018 March of return).
Also the dead from the War on Terror includes Iraq, Somalia, Libya, Syria, and Yemen, all abject disasters and none of which had anything to do with 9/11. You might as well point to the Holocaust and say “see Gaza’s not as bad.” True, yes. Also completely irrelevant as to whether the massacres there are justified or worth US support.
Now I understand why anyone over 50 isn’t falling for your Hasbara. It’s so stupid only a boomer would be dumb enough to believe it.
False analogy. "Palestinians" are not the native population; most Arabs in the area are fairly recent arrivals. Many in the West Bank are from Syria and many in Gaza are from Egypt. Palestinian leader Yasser Arafat, for example, was born in Cairo, to an Egyptian family. And the major city in the area, Jerusalem, has had a Jewish majority since the 1870s.
While the Arabs conquered Jerusalem in 635 AD, most families arrived from Arab countries much more recently, and a "Palestinian" identity (as a group, separate from Arabs) did not emerge until the 1920s, in response to the growing Zionist movement, and concern over the British support for Jews over Arabs.
As for your condescending ageism, I suggest you learn some facts before claiming a superior understanding of history. Your comments reveal a lack of facts or ability for complex thinking – maybe suitable for Harvard or Columbia, but otherwise inadequate.
Or they descended from the ancient Hebrews who converted to Christianity and then Islam, something some of the early Zionists believed and which a few today believe may hold the key to resolving the conflict https://www.palestine-studies.org/en/node/77959
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tsvi_Misinai#%22The_Engagement%22:_A_solution_to_the_Israeli%E2%80%93Palestinian_conflict
If you have some sources for your other assertions I would be glad to take a look at them though.
The Middle East has a lot of different genetic groups, but ultimately what matters is how people self-identify.
As for Egypt and Gaza, it depends how far back you want to go. Like much of the area, the history goes back for thousands of years. Ancient Egypt once ruled there, as did the Mamluks, a mercenary empire based in Egypt. Egypt also took control of Gaza after the 1947-48 war in Israel, although they no longer claim ownership. And while Yasser Arafat was born in Cairo to an Egyptian family, his father was born in Gaza, as Arabs moved in and out of the various countries in the area for jobs.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_Gaza#:~:text=The%20known%20history%20of%20Gaza,dynasties%2C%20empires%2C%20and%20peoples.&text=Originally%20a%20Canaanite%20settlement%2C%20it,of%20the%20Philistines'%20principal%20cities.
As to which group had a majority in Jerusalem, here is a source:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demographic_history_of_Jerusalem
Some good reading thanks very much. It doesn’t justify the US aiding and abetting wholesale carnage, but proves interesting none the less, especially how Jews, Muslims and Christians apparently managed to live together in Jerusalem with major bloodshed for a lot of the 19th and early 20th centuries.
How you can use a word like ‘brutality’ as some sort of justification is ridiculous. The brutality israel has put on for all to see, is the worst I’ve ever seen. Your answer to brutality is to bury people alive with bulldozers, set up torture camps in the desert, starve over 2million people, mostly children….honestly the list of crimes against humanity is so long , I can’t possibly lost them all. Is there a crime they haven’t committed yet? Israel claims to be moral, but just believing you are God’s chosen people, does not make them moral. The 1st hand accounts of idf rapes are common, but being sodomized by electrical probed is a specisl idf treat? I’m not surprised, isrsel is known to be a pedophile haven with 230 rapes reported every day.
What should be done to make peace you ask? Bring in the u.n. and submit to international law, turn all illegal settlements into Palestinian homes while you fix gaza. Tear down the ealls, end the occupation…there’s much that could’ve been done, unfortunately, this so called war has been the plan for 100yrs. It’s genocide, by zionistd, hiding behind and using the holocaust and antisemitism ss a sick weapon. Why jewish people can’t understand what never again means, is shocking. You cry never again as you collectively punish 2million people with massive bombs, execute thousands, even hostages and Christians, the constant murders in the west bank. Zionists are the scum of the earth, worse than any terrorist organizations they fight. Your god will certainly banish you all again, for all the same reasons as before. Delusions of supremacy, unkindness, greed, avarice, on and on. Your inhumanity will be your curse to be remembered by.
What nonsense.
1. The Hamas attack on Israelis was deliberately brutal; that is just a fact. You can deny it all you want but that won't change the fact. Watch the videos – shot by Hamas – if you feel otherwise.
2. You claim the actions by Israel are the "worse I've ever seen". It may be true – in your case – but you ignore other conflicts; how about the death of 580,000 civilians in Syrian during their ongoing conflict, which included the use of poison gas on civilians? How about the 50,000 civilians who died in Chechnya? How about the 1,000,000 civilians who died in the "War on Terror", or the 800,000 Hutus killed in Rwanda? None of these atrocities justify or negate the war going on now, but it is hardly "the worst". The United States also killed millions expanding their nation; the 100 million Native people were reduced to practically nothing, and as many as 100 million Africans died bringing enslaved people to the various colonies. 600,000 people died in the US Civil War, and more than 1,000,000 civilians died in US bombing of German and Japanese cities – including those instantly incinerated (or slowly poisoned) by nuclear weapons.
3. You state that Zionists – people who support a Jewish homeland – are the "scum of the earth." I was told I would be banned for saying that people in the Middle East don't along, but apparently you can call a group of people – based on their beliefs – "the scum of the earth," and the moderator is fine with that. OK, I see where the bias lies.
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You state that Zionists – people who support a Jewish homeland – are the “scum of the earth.” I was told I would be banned for saying that people in the Middle East don’t along, but apparently you can call a group of people – based on their beliefs – “the scum of the earth,” and the moderator is fine with that. OK, I see where the bias lies.
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Our guidelines forbid “slurs or supremacist claims based on race, ethnicity, nationality, religion, disability, sex, sexual orientation or gender identity.”
Zionism is none of those things. It is not an innate characteristic. It’s a philosophy / political movement. That makes it fair game, just like any other philosophy or political movement.
Collectivist characterizations based on innate characteristics are what violate our guidelines. Most of the ones that end up getting deleted are slurs against Jews. But you’re not special just because the target of your ethno-nationalist crap is Palestinians.
OK, thanks for clarifying.
However, I thought my comments were thoughtful and fact based; however, it appears my comments here are "crap".
When you collectively characterize "the Palestinians," you're not being any more "thoughtful" or "fact-based" than if your targets were Jews, persons of African descent, or hnomosexuals.
That would depend on the context. Palestinians are a group that exist outside of anything I might say, including the Palestinian Authority, the Nation of Palestine, and people, such as Rashida Tlaib, who self-identify as Palestinian. There is also the UN, which refers to Palestine Refugees.
https://www.unrwa.org/palestine-refugees
So, your comment is vague but dismissive; as you claim I am not being fact-based, can you provide an example where I have referred to Palestinians in a way that is false or not supported by facts?
I gave you the exact language of our guidelines.
You don’t have to like those guidelines. They’re our guidelines whether you like them or not.
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You state that Zionists – people who support a Jewish homeland – are the “scum of the earth.” I was told I would be banned for saying that people in the Middle East don’t along, but apparently you can call a group of people – based on their beliefs – “the scum of the earth,” and the moderator is fine with that. OK, I see where the bias lies.
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Our guidelines forbid “slurs or supremacist claims based on race, ethnicity, nationality, religion, disability, sex, sexual orientation or gender identity.”
Zionism is none of those things. It is not an innate characteristic. It’s a philosophy / political movement. That makes it fair game, just like any other philosophy or political movement.
Collectivist characterizations based on innate characteristics are what violate our guidelines. Most of the ones that end up getting deleted are slurs against Jews. But you’re not special just because the target of your ethno-nationalist crap is Palestinians.
—–
You state that Zionists – people who support a Jewish homeland – are the “scum of the earth.” I was told I would be banned for saying that people in the Middle East don’t along, but apparently you can call a group of people – based on their beliefs – “the scum of the earth,” and the moderator is fine with that. OK, I see where the bias lies.
—–
Our guidelines forbid “slurs or supremacist claims based on race, ethnicity, nationality, religion, disability, sex, sexual orientation or gender identity.”
Zionism is none of those things. It is not an innate characteristic. It’s a philosophy / political movement. That makes it fair game, just like any other philosophy or political movement.
Collectivist characterizations based on innate characteristics are what violate our guidelines. Most of the ones that end up getting deleted are slurs against Jews. But you’re not special just because the target of your ethno-nationalist crap is Palestinians.
Well, most of your examples of brutality are examples of real wars, between armed combatants. What makes Israel’s ‘war’ so noteworthy, is the slaughter of 15,000 children, 40 000 people , almost entirely unarmed living in refugee camps. This is a clear case of ethnic cleansing, they even brag about it as they enact plans to take the west bank. This is also the 1st conflicyt so widely viewed online, exposing Israel’s cruelty , their summary executions of the elderly, ofchildren, the mass graves, people buried alive, the torture, the absolute disregard for any international laws, bombing of hospitals and schools…all part of a dispicable plan, dreamed up by zionists 100yrs ago, enacted unapologetically by zionists. The world sees their true nature, their acts and the world will reject them for their tyranny.
Of course, you’re the victim, life is so unfair for you Zionists, your morality should excuse all this stealing of lands through forcible displacement, the law shouldn’t apply to gods chosen scammers.
Zionism goooood.
It's a simple inference. Hamas had a strategy and spent years and millions of dollars developing it:
1. Hamas plans a complex attack on their neighbor.
2. Hamas militants attack civilians and murder entire families, including children and babies, with great violence, even filming/broadcasting the attacks.
3. Hamas takes 250 Israelis and others as hostages and retreats to Gaza and hides in tunnels. They do not prepare or secure the civilian population.
4. Hamas anticipates that Israel will come for Hamas and that woman and children that Hamas set up as human shields would die.
If you think this inference is wrong, then explain why and what Hamas expected to happen.
Nothing you said, and no matter how many times you say it, makes Israel's actions any less barbaric. And nobody is making them choose to be the barbarians that they are. Anyone, other than terrorists, don't have rules of engagement that completely disregard the safety of innocent civilians. That is what Israel is, and has been doing since Oct 7th. So, you are admitting that Israel is terrorists. Shooting anything that moves, leveling entire city blocks and creating a famine are things other terrorists only dream of doing but Israel does.
That Civilians die in urban warfare is a sad fact, but i think your view that many of us truly antiwar people, think its like video games, is ironic. Since when is it normal for an occupying force to commit heinous war crimes and crimes against humanity? This isn't a war, it's a genocide. Imagine if people during ww2 made excuses for concentration camps and the mass murder of jews. At some point these zionists will have to be stopped. It isnt hamas in Lebanon, syria, iran or Jordan, yet the war expands. Whats your justification for that? Does it matter that this could easily be the beginning of ww3, all because israel wants the whole region to be their ethnostate and want all Palestinians dead or displaced. Its never been about hostages, its about expanding the land theft and rewriting history. Israel is run by extreme right facists, yet you think they are innocents, just defending themselves. Keep defending the indefensible genocide.
People get tired of being a punching bag.
No doubt. And the Palestinians are the bag, and the parasite terrorists are the ones doing the punching with state-of-the-art weaponry provided by the US. You truly are a sickening little bitch.
Yes-lets do it-Hamas releases all hostages,and Israel leaves all of Gaza.Let Hamas and its masters repent on the genocide they caused.
Actually, Hamas has agreed to release all of the hostages if Israel leaves Gaza. But Netanyahu and his government would rather kill the hostages than end the war.
Hamas should release any civilian hostages without preconditions. Its not only the right thing to do, but as a colonial regime Israel doesn't value civilians any more than soldiers and in fact probably values them less; old people and kids can't murder Palestinians so well.
Keep any troops including reservists. They are prisoners of war, not "hostages."
Hamas claims that the only prisoners they are still holding are military or security personnel including reservists.* In Israel all members of the dominant religion/ethnicity except the ultra orthodox, are drafted and remain members of the reserve until the age of 40 except for women who have children. So most of the attendees at the Nova festival were reservists.
*Hamas qualifies this claim by stating that given the security conditions in Gaza it is impossible for Hamas to know exactly how many prisoners are being held, where they are and how many are dead or alive.
Calling Israeli a "colonial regime" is not accurate and clearly they put enormous value on their citizens.
1. Israel is not a "colony" of another country, unlike your nation (US), which was a colony taken from the indigenous people.
Arabs, Jews, and Christians have lived in the South Levant for centuries; the territory was conquered by the Ottoman, then the British. During British rule, violence between Arabs and Jews increased, and the UN recommended a partition, which the Jews accepted but the Arabs denied. So, at no point was this a "colony".
2. You've got the concern for civilians backwards. Clearly, Hamas knew that Israel would counter-strike following the attack on Oct. 7; it seems designed to trigger a response. However, while Israel sends in troops to fight Hamas, Hamas puts its fighters in hospitals, schools, and homes, and uses women and children as human shields while they hide underground in tunnels. There are no tunnels for the women and children they use as deliberate human sacrifices.
“the UN recommended a partition, which the Jews accepted but the Arabs denied.”
Some Jews accepted, and some Arabs denied.
“the UN recommended a partition, which the Jews accepted but the Arabs denied.”
Some Jews accepted, and some Arabs denied.
Most colonies don't dictate the foreign policy of the mother country so I guess you have a point on that front. On the other hand the number of Americans who end up settling the West Bank sure looks like colonialism to me. http://timesofisrael.com/in…
1Israel is not a "colony" of the United States, but it has ties with many nations. Claiming that Israel dictates the foreign policy of the United States is unfounded. Israel is a ally (actually, a "major non-NATO ally" by law) and the US supports its allies (as every country does and must).
Remember that the people Israel is fighting murdered and kidnapped American citizens. Most people would consider that unfriendly. Israel it trying to get them back. Do you disapprove?
“Remember that the people Israel is fighting murdered and kidnapped American citizens. Most people would consider that unfriendly.”
Yes, it is unfriendly.
And Israel has also done it.
The discussion was about America's role in the Israel-Hamas conflict.
The US can decide to help one, both, or neither. As an anarchist, you might argue that neither side deserves support.
I would say that one side is an American ally, while the other supports those who oppose US interests, and has done this for nearly 100 years.
Common sense would say that, if a nation is allowed to act in its own self-interest, then it would support those who help it and oppose those who threaten it. You might argue that all war is bad and it would end if people just stopped. Well, throughout human history, that has never happened. We have to live in the real world. I lock my door at night. Do you?
"As an anarchist, you might argue that neither side deserves support."
Bingo.
Israel has killed US citizens as well and all the State Department offers are crickets. https://www.cnn.com/2024/02/23/world/palestinian-americans-demand-answers-invs/index.html. Meanwhile many of the Israeli killed by Hamas were IDF members; fighting for an apartheid regime can be hazardous for your health. Just ask the Rhodesians. https://www.washingtonpost.com/national-security/2024/01/23/americans-killed-israel-gaza-war/.
Meanwhile Israel’s control over Washington continue to come to light https://www.politico.com/news/2024/06/05/israel-targeted-lawmakers-in-disinformation-campaign-00161906 including the fact that every Republican other than Thomas Massie apparently has an AIPAC babysitter https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hir03BkDZOc.
As far as getting the hostages back, I heartily approve; a ceasefire brought back over a hundred in November. Another permanent one can bring home the rest. However Bibi has ruled it out. https://news.antiwar.com/2024/06/24/netanyahu-rejects-any-deal-that-leads-to-permanent-end-to-war-on-gaza/ Do you approve of his decision?
1. Israel is a US ally. Hamas is designated a terrorist group by the US and they hold US citizens as hostages. Israel supports US security with military technology, spying, and computer/software advances. Hamas does not.
Israel is allied with US allies in the region, such as Jordan and Egypt. Hamas is allied with "Death to American" Iran and Russian/Iranian proxies Syria and Lebanon.
The world is a cruel place and countries need allies. Allies determine the balance of power. The US must support its allies, not those of its enemies.
2. Israel is not an "Apartheid regime." No matter how much you repeat that, it is not true. Israel left Gaza in 2005, and would have left them alone if they simply did not attack them. And Gaza did not live under a two-class system, because they do not allow Israelis to live in Gaza after they illegally occupied the territory. They don't even allow the Palestinian Authority there.
In Israel itself, Israeli Arabs have more rights than in any Arab country, and they also have the longest life expectancy in the Arab world. They also have a longer life expectancy that African Americans in the United States (77 years vs. 70 years), but apparently you don't worry about your own country.
3. As for DC, lobbyists are part of life there. So, what's your point? Do you think that the United States would abandon a powerful military ally in a crucial region of the world simply if not for some lobbyists? If so, you have zero understanding of geopolitics and how the world works.
4. As for a permanent ceasefire, that makes no sense to me. The only logical conclusion to this war is the destruction of Hamas. Half-measures won't work.
There were people during the US Civil War who wanted to negotiate without surrender; the same with the Germans and Japanese in WWII.
Wars involve deaths to soldiers and civilians and terrible, tough decisions. In WWII, many argued against bombing civilians in Germany, or the use of nuclear weapons in a Japan that was clearly beaten. America went ahead with these.
In this case, my opinion is that Israel has no choice but to destroy Hamas; anything else would only reward them and encourage them to regroup and attack again. So, you asked my opinion – there it is.
Maybe American life expectancies would be longer of we invested money in improving American healthcare. Instead of funneling money to prop of the Neo-Con’s favorite client states.
Also there is no way we would have seen the assault on freedom of speech we have seen in the last 8 months were it not for the Israel lobby’s influence on American politicians http://thefederalist.com/2024/03/28/texas-gov-greg-abbott-endorses-dei-cult-with-demands-for-jewish-safe-spaces/
https://www.texasobserver.org/a-lawsuit-30-years-ago-affirmed-free-speech-on-texas-college-campuses/
https://reason.com/2024/04/29/bipartisan-legislation-would-let-the-government-create-speech-chilling-antisemitism-monitors/
And if Israel just wants to get rid of Hamas in Gaza, why are we seeing so many illegal settlers continue to displace Palestinians in the West Bank as noted by anti-propagandist Jon Stewart?https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=RkwgnlPRdHg
Yes, the hostages are not the issue; the security of Israel is the issue, and as long as Hamas exists, they are a threat. Some enemies must be destroyed. Hamas is one of them.
Netanyahu Rejects Any Deal That Ends Gaza War
More than a million people have been displaced from Rafah since the IDF seized the vital Rafah border crossing with Egypt on May 7 and subsequently destroyed it, deliberately exacerbating the already catastrophic humanitarian crisis caused by the massive bombing campaign and its concomitant starvation siege.
What is important to mention is that Rafah had a population of 275,000 before the slaughter started. So, it was mostly people already displaced that were displaced yet once more. And they were told to move there to avoid getting massacred where they originally lived. It takes a special kind of evil to do that. The IDF terrorists have once more proved that they have no peers.
No, but only one of the two "main" candidates will win in November.
That's up to the voters.
Not necessarily…!