Explosions hit two Russian air bases deep inside Russian territory early Monday morning, killing three Russian soldiers and damaging two aircraft, the Russian Defense Ministry said.
Blasts were reported at the Dyagilevo airfield in the Ryazan Oblast and Engels airfield in the Saratov Oblast, two locations that are over 250 miles from the Ukrainian border. The Russian Defense Ministry said the attacks were carried out by Ukraine using a number of drones.
Kyiv hasn’t taken official credit for the attack, but an anonymous senior Ukrainian official speaking to The New York Times said Ukrainian forces were responsible. The official said the drones were launched from Ukrainian territory and claimed one strike was made with the help of Ukrainian special forces inside Russia. The Times report said that the Engels airfield houses some Russian long-range nuclear-capable bombers.
Drone attacks have been reported throughout the war in Russian regions near the Ukrainian border, but the incident on Monday is significantly further inside Russia than previous attacks.
Following the attacks in Ryazan and Engels, Russia launched another barrage of missile strikes targeting energy infrastructure in Ukraine, putting more pressure on Ukraine’s already decimated power grid.
Russian strikes targeted major Ukrainian cities, including Kyiv and Odessa. According to South Front, the strikes left the Sumy and Mykolaiv regions without power, and partial blackouts were reported in the Kharkiv, Zhytomyr, and Odessa regions.
The Russian Defense Ministry described the missile barrage as a “massive strike” on Ukrainian infrastructure and said all “17 assigned objectives were hit.” Russia did not launch large-scale attacks on Ukrainian energy infrastructure until after the October truck bombing of the Kerch Bridge, which connects Crimea to the Russian mainland.
The Russian attacks on energy infrastructure have left Ukrainian civilians in a dire situation, as millions are without power, heat, and water. Ukraine is struggling to repair its power grid and is looking to the US and its other Western backers for support.
145 thoughts on “Explosions Hit Air Bases Deep Inside Russia, Killing Three Russian Soldiers”
This is just insanity on the part of the US.
It makes sense if the US thinks it is getting creamed on the battlefield. Trying to create a scenario where we are justified in using our brand new B-21 state of the art Stealth Bomber does not give me warm fuzzy feelings.
C’mon, why would you think the US had anything to do with this? They aren’t “directly” involved after all.
Wow, I would have thought it was a smoking accident yet again. This is an interesting development it looks like they have rigged their drones to work with Starlink so they can drive them all the way to Moscow if they want to.
They can. It is a good way to maximize the odds of attacks west of Ukraine, and would be a very effective way to unite the rest of the world 100% against the US
It is only going to get worse until Russia gives up Putin’s war of aggression.
This is a war that Russia never had a chance of winning. The victories by the Ukrainian Army have been impressive. But these attacks and the attacks on the Kerch Bridge and on Russia’s Crimean bases are the face of the resistance that will inevitably kick the Russian army out of Ukraine. Putin’s war was originally billed as a benevolent “special military operation” to liberate Ukraine from a non-existent Nazi regime. But the war has become a war against the Ukrainian people and the Ukrainian nation. It is a war that Putin’s army can’t win. Every Russian escalation has strengthened the Ukrainian resistance. The more the Ukrainians suffer, the harder they will fight against the Russian invaders. With three and a half million Ukrainians living in Russia before the invasion created millions of Ukrainian refugees, the guerrilla war in Russia will resemble “the Troubles” in England during the wars for Irish independence and unification. Significantly, the Ukrainian resistance is being aided by Russians of good will who recognize Putin’s invasion for what it really is and want no part of it. Five of the eight suspects arrested in the Kerch Bridge attack are Russian citizens. The only question is how long it will take for Russia to get a government with the courage to walk back from Putin’s folly.
The “Russians of good will” and their collaborators you cite duped an innocent man into unknowingly driving a gigantic bomb they detonated over the Kerch bridge killing him and other civilians. What hero’s!
Likely these “hero’s” were criminals payed with American money to do this job.
And yes. It’s pretty clear that the Ukrainian regime is dominated by ultra nationalists. You can claim that they aren’t Nazi’s despite the fact that they harken back to the Bandera thugs of the 1940’s including all the symbols and paraphernalia. If it looks like a Nazi, talks like a Nazi, acts like a Nazi…. It’s a Nazi.
Western war propaganda is a powerful drug. It intoxicates people’s minds to a point beyond redemption. Russia cannot lose the war in Ukraine, no matter how many weapons Nato pours into the country. And if you know anything about Ukraine, you also know that the country is split right along the middle. The Eastern part is predominantly populated by ethnic Russians who have been waiting for 8 years to be liberate from a repressive Nazi regime that has been murdering them all that time, even if the West has turned a blind eye and pretends not to know.
Ukraine has not achieved a single victory in the war. The Russians went in with a small force because they never intended to conquer the country. That’s why they withdrew from some places. Their aim is “demilitarization” and not to conquer land. If the Ukrainians bring their soldiers to the front to be slaughtered, it makes Russia’s task easier than if Russia had to destroy enemy forces in offensive operations. Ukraine keeps its casualties secrete for a reason. If the scale of Ukraine’s losses became public, it would lead to an immediate collapse of the war effort. Thus, Ukrainian soldiers are being slaughtered out of sight of the public eye. The cynicism is beyond description.
One should in general avoid using the accounts of e.g. the Ukrainians (or the west) to assess their own progress and achievements and do the same for the Russians.
Why – this is a statement without corroboration it might be true, but you have not made an argument for it being so.
Not even the Russians believe that the Russian speakers on the east side of the Dnieper are longing to be liberated – if in doubt just watch the first 58 seconds of this Russian state TV interview:
If that is the case why did Putin annex Kherson, Donets, Luhansk and Zaporizhzhia?
The Ukrainians do no more keep their casualties a secret than the Russians keep theirs a secret – so are you claiming that the Russian losses are of a scale that would lead to a collapse of the war effort?
As are the Russian soldiers – this is just standard practice so I think you read too much into it, especially as you do not conclude anything from the Russians doing exactly the same.
I didn’t keep up the count, but I think the Russians did publish their casualties. They also regularly publish Ukrainian casualties. As to the latter, the EU’s Commission President’s recent announcement that Ukrainians had lost more than 100,000 soldiers is quite revealing. The announcement was edited only minutes later and the sentence in question was deleted. That reveals: 1) Ukrainian casualties are enormous 2) the West/Ukraine try to hide the number of dead Ukrainian soldiers so that more Ukrainians may be fed into the the meat grinder and the flow of Nato weapons doesn’t stop. The best estimate of Russian/Ukrainian KIA is 1/5-10 because of superior Russian firing power. If people knew the real number of casualties, there would be more calls for peace talks. That’s what they are trying to prevent, because the war must go on to the last Ukrainian, as US Senator Lindsay Graham said.
Merkel refused to supply weapons to Ukraine for 8 years because the Russians have escalation dominance in Ukraine. In other words, no matter how many weapons Nato sends to Ukraine, Russia can send more. The Russians don’t have the means to beat the US, let’s say in Mexico, but there is no way Russia can be defeated in Ukraine, not even by Nato, and certainly not by Ukraine. But you don’t have to take my word for it. The Russians just sent a greater force which, for the first time, gives them almost parity with the number of Ukrainian troops. Before now, the Ukrainians had a superiority of 3/1 while normally the attacking force needs a 3/1 superiority. That just goes to show what the Russians achieved with a very small force. Even with the reinforcement, the Russians have only mobilized 1.2% of their reserves. Thus, they have plenty of scope to match any escalation.
There are undoubtedly Ukrainians even in the East who want to stay in Ukraine, however, those who have suffered from Kyiv’s shelling of their homes for the last 8 years certainly don’t.
PS: I don’t quite know what you want to tell me by linking a Russian nationalist interviewed on an anti-Russian propaganda site.
they did twice and both times so low as to make it obvious that they were not telling the truth.
The Ukrainians also publish Russian losses – again normal – the Ukrainian figures are for 90.000 dead – as stated you should not believe such propaganda – the Russians have several times published figures for having destroyed more Ukrainian material that they had at the time – so as I say not credible propoganda (on both sides probably).
Because the idea that she misspoke does not fit your desired position -she actually said 100.000 officers (that would be 500.000 dead at least – not a figure that could be hidden).
No the Russians have lost far more than that – how much is difficult to say, but if the figures were as you stated they would not have needed to start conscription.
Lets see – but at least you have made the argument now.
Which is why they have had to vacate territory taken at great expense and territory they have ostentatiously annexed?
They had parity (or near parity) in the early days of the SMO – lets see what they can do now – do you expect an offensive that takes e.g. the rest of Donetsk?
their problem is not mobilization, but equipping, training and supplying the mobilized men.
That would be the ones on the Russian side of the line of contact – Putin has greatly diminished their numbers by forcibly conscripting them using them in costly offensives in e.g. Bakmut (and ignoring them in the casualty figures) – so far more of them have died at the hands of Putin than dies fighting Kyiv.
Von der Leyen meant “soldiers” not “officers”. She’s not a native speaker. She should have said something like “service men and women” to be politically correct, but that was a bit too complicated, so she or her speechwriter went for officers, like a police officer, who is just an ordinary policeman. She used to be defense minister and made a proper mess of it, but like most Germans she’s adverse to the military. So the last thing you can expect her to know are rank and file designations in foreign languages. She used the >100,000 figure because that’s the most reliable estimate I have seen from different sources. That makes about 10k to 20k Russian KIA. Again, you don’t have to believe me, but the truth will come out eventually. In the meantime, it’s beyond cynical to send more men into the meatgrinder, especially so, because each day the conflict continues, the size of the future Ukraine will diminish. <100k KIA means 200k to 300k more taken off the battle field for treating wounds. That's about half the size of the force Ukraine started with. In other words, demilitarization is making good progress. All these young lives are thrown away because some senile old politician doesn't want to lose face. In the end, the US will dump Ukraine like it dumped Afghanistan last year and so many others before. Afghans are now reduced to selling their organs and children just to keep from starving. It's a grim world and we should not become complicit.
She is a German officers is offizieren in German so no English not being her native language is not the issue – soldiers would be soldaten – this is not the explanation.
As there is no difference between German and English and as she has been defense minister there is no basis for thinking that she would not know the difference between a soldier and an officer – you are clutching at straws here.
What sources would that be?
The figure of western estimates are at about 100.000 for both parties that is killed and wounded in both cases.
I do not believe any of the parties – but we agree that the truth will likely come out eventually. My beef with your idea that you know the Russian casualties to be so much lower than the Ukrainian ones is that if this was really the case then Russia would hardly have had to vacate so much territory.
Seeing as I do not believe in the figures (though I am willing to accept that they are not small for either side) – it is not cynical to allow the Ukrainians to fight as long as they desire to do so – as I point out repeatedly – they have the same option as the Afghans – i.e. they can always opt not to fight.
The fact that they do not the fact that Zelenskyy is seen again and again walking freely in open spaces among his troops strongly indicates that there is not a very significant number of soldiers very unwilling to fight (there were some in April/May when the Ukrainians were pressed the most, but far fewer now) all polls indicate the same as does the loads of videos of Ukrainians celebrating being liberated – the Russians are unable to show the same.
Exactly so if it was true then Ukraine would not be able to keep the Russians from taking the territory they are assaulting let alone force then to vacate more territory every month than they take as has been the case since September.
No because the Russians do not offer them a better alternative to fighting – if this was not the case then the Ukrainians would no more wish to die than the Afghans.
It is more likely to be the Russians suffering this fate than the Ukrainians – the way the Russians are ‘winning’ the last 3 months.
“Seeing as I do not believe in the figures (though I am willing to accept that they are not small for either side) – it is not cynical to allow the Ukrainians to fight as long as they desire to do so – as I point out repeatedly – they have the same option as the Afghans – i.e. they can always opt not to fight. ”
The vast majority did not want to fight. It’s the regime urged on by the far-right militias and Washington that escalated the conflict. Individual Ukrainians have no choice. If 73% of the population vote for peace and the government then takes them to war, that means that democracy is just a farce. You don’t seem to understand what it means to be drafted into military service in time of war. If you refuse the order to fight, you’ll be shot. If you try to desert from the battle, you get a bullet in the back of your head from your serving officer. Don’t pretend that you or the regime speaks for all Ukrainians.
Why do you think the Ukrainians have no choice on an individual level if the Afghans did?
If 73% do not want to fight the Russians then there would be no war and there certainly would be no celebration of liberations – the Russians have far more problems than the Ukrainians with protests leaked to the net, why is it that you suppose that the Ukrainians not only fight when they could surrender but also opt to protest so very much more seldom?
If 3/4 of my co conscripts think like I do then we will be a very ineffective force and we will be able to surrender in very much higher numbers than what we observe the Russians taking prisoners – according to your theory the Afghans would still be fighting – why do you think they are not?
The officers could not delegate duties as they would have to be present everywhere to shoot deserters, and if they acted like this they would face a bullet in their head when they turned their backs – again look no further than to Afghanistan to realize that forcing people fundamentally opposed to the war to fight for a thing they do not believe in is not these days possible.
“The vast majority did not want to fight. It’s the regime urged on by the far-right militias and Washington that escalated the conflict. Individual Ukrainians have no choice.”
Indeed, hard to judge “desire” to fight – or have husbands or male children fight – as a transparent question, when limited choice and ‘preferred narratives’ are involved…though even mainstream press gives some glimpses:
1/ “In Lviv, a city in the West that has avoided serious shelling, wives and mothers of men in the 103rd Territorial Defense Brigade have protested, terrified about their husbands’ and sons’ deployment into combat in the East. To assuage concerns, a commander…met with about 200 women in a concert hall but the conversation devolved into screaming and crying, local media reported.”
NYT, “A whistle, then a deadly barrage. Ukraine’s soldiers…”
2/ “Ukrainians express worries over conscription following Russia’s invasion” NPR
3/ “Ukraine’s Draft Dodgers Face Guilt, Shame and Reproach” NYT
Yes, I have heard about that. There are also reports that the Kyiv regime now tries to recruit especially in the Russian-speaking East and South because it considers that if these people want to join Russia, they might as well serve as cannon fodder in the fight against Russia. Sort of like, two birds with one stone, 1) get Russian-speaking Ukrainians killed, and 2) feed more fresh meat into the meat-grinder of war. I’m not sure if it’s true, but I wouldn’t put beyond what Kyiv is capable of.
The OP I replied to had some very naïve ideas about how recruits would be able to refuse fighting in times of war. There is no arguing with that degree of naivety.
Yes, I have heard about this. I also heard that Kyiv preferably recruits Russian-speakers in the East and South of Ukraine under the assumptions that they might as well be used as cannon fodder if they want to joint Russia. It’s like killing two birds with one stone: 1) get the Russian-speaking Ukrainians killed as part of an effort at ethnic cleansing, 2) throw more fresh meat into the meat-grinder of war. I’m not sure it is true, but I wouldn’t put it beyond what Kyiv is capable of.
The OP I replied to seems to have very naïve ideas about the freedom a recruit has for refusing to fight in a war. It’s hard to discuss with that degree of naivety.
“Cry ‘Havoc!’ , and let slip the dogs of war.” As Mark Antony said in William Shakespeare’s Julius Caesar! The Biggest Mistake of Zelensky’s Life is about to unleash the dogs of War like has not been seen since 1944.
“Explosions Hit Air Bases Deep Inside Russia, Killing Three Russian Soldiers”
Deep inside Russia is an understatement. Saratov Oblast is well past Moscow to the southeast and Ryazan Oblast is closer to Moscow to the southeast.
With Winter now freezing the ground in Ukraine this Russian winter offensive may start sooner than later. The current temperature in Donetsk is -7 c and will not reach -2 c during the day.
This attack on mother Russia may just galvanize the rage of Russians who may want Ukraine removed from the world stage permanently. Attacking a border check point is one thing, but deep inside Russia is another.
General Sergei Surovikin: the ‘General Armageddon’ now in charge of Russia’s war may release Russia’s full fury upon Ukraine. This rage and offensive has not been seen since Marshal Georgy Konstantinovich Zhukov unleashed the full fury of Russia driving the occupying Wehrmacht troop all the way back to Berlin from the outskirts of Moscow.
This attack on Russia may be the biggest mistake of Zelensky’s limited time in power. Between General Winter and General Armageddon a white hot rage is about to descend upon Ukraine.
I wish you were wrong.
My only gripe with your post is I am not convinced that Ukraine even knew about the attack until afterwards.
To attack that deeply onto Russia certainly would have at least required the permission of the US, not to mention a huge amount of surveillance support.
The odds are that Ukraine will pay a huge price for this attack. Meanwhile, it seems that the US is trying so hard to provoke Russia into doing something truly stupid. Meanwhile, Russia persists in not doing something truly stupid.
Do you work in Kyiv? Are you suggesting the US launched this attack?
Ukraine if fighting for its existence as a nation. This is war, I’m pretty sure they can launch attacks on military targets in Russia if they want/need to.
“The odds that Ukraine… ”
Ukraine has been paying the price since Feb 24 when it got invaded but Russia is also paying the price. War is a two way street.
Whenever something doesn’t look good from the Russian side:
1) It didn’t happen; or
2) The Russians meant for it to happen; or
3) It wasn’t the Ukrainians who made it happen.
Sometimes, one of those reasons may be true, though.
It’s the Kremlin way i must admit.
The Russians do correct their mistakes, we don’t, our so-called leaders keep digging the hole deeper at the expense of the Ukrainian nation and the whole of continental Europe.
The UK together with the USA and the cowardly NATO members are committing genocide on the Ukrainian nation. They are criminals, let us be clear about that. Working up to WW III is the war crime of this century, at least equal to the Nazis in the last century.
And all this time I thought it was Russia who invaded on full force targeting at will anything on sight in Ukraine.
Man was I wrong.
You can twist it all you want, the FACT REMAINS the neocons, Biden and company, want war with Russia. Senile Biden always was a war monger, nothing has changed, he learned nothing from Vietnam, Iraq and Afghanistan, he is a war criminal. Biden and his cahoots are the nation’s worst administration ever, unable to even think. They are criminal, psychopaths’. They are after more power and more money, despicable to put it mildly.
Yep, and Putin is a Saint.
Putin is protecting his country and people, Zelensky is throwing his people and country under the bus for Biden and the American MIC. Biden/Zelensky together are annihilating Ukraine, there will be nothing left of Ukraine even if Biden/Zelensky and NATO win the war. There will be no EU and NATO left and nothing but scorched earth of the continent if Biden/Zelensky and neocons in DC and Azov in Ukraine win.
And you’re telling that to someone who does the exact thing regarding Ukraine.
Give me an example, but don’t make sh!t up. Go, bring me some archive quotes.
Every time you open your mouth. How’s that?
UKRAINE IS NOT FIGHTING FOR IT’S EXISTENTS.
THAT IS THE LIE OF THE CENTURY.
Ukraine had the option to become a neutral nation, all Russia wanted was a security to not be attacked by NATO with nuclear weapons close to the Russian border.
The USA made sure that did not happen, they need Ukraine to stage a war to invade Russia, for now they have it, the same goes for continental Europe it was always meant to be the battle ground for WW III.
That’s the BS Russia propaganda has been airing for decades.
The real reason has been told by your own boy, Putin. What was that he said on 23 Feb? Something along the lines of ‘Ukraine is part of Russia’
But let me ask you this: Would you have fought to defend Ukraine during a Russian invasion if you were Ukrainian?
No, you’d probably be one of those collaborators.
Only Azov people, Ukrainian neo-Nazis fight willingly for US interests believing they are their interest too.
That is why Zelensky’s people use guns to make conscripts fight.
His big sacrifice consists of wearing a green T-shirt and making demands for more money.
Wake up and smell the coffee for a change. You are being used.
Zelensky has several mansions to flee to and a fat bank account, plus his ticket to get out. Only stupid Azov people fight for the US interests, Zelensky throws his nation under the bus for that, he is the traitor of the nation.
Zelensky is as corrupt as it gets.
‘That is why Zelensky’s people use guns to make conscripts fight.’
I thought this was the Russians doing this. Plenty of evidence of this. Why try to flip this story? That makes you dishonest and a bigot.
Ukrainians don’t need to be forced to fight, they have plenty of volunteers. There is a difference when you have reason to fight for (i.e. nation, freedom, children, future).
if Z is as rich as Kremlin makes you belive, the fact that he is still in Kyiv working for his nation, asking daily for more support and not in a Yacht somewhere in a sunny island… that makes me have a lot of respect for him. And BTW, Zelensky has a huge approval rating in Ukraine but don’t take it from me, ask any Ukrainian you may run into, if your hatred allows you to do so. They’ll also tell you that they will fight for Ukraine with or without the West.
without permission from D.C. they do nothing and you must know that.
Please don’t try to claim that Ukraine acts independently of the US. It trashes your reputation, and convinces people from other nations that Americans are not to be trusted.
I apologize for one thing. I did not mean to suggest that the attack was a US attack that had aid from Ukrainians, I meant to state it clearly.
Well except for the fact that they have lost most of their good tanks, and the mob nicks are not well trained nor well supplied. It is going to be ugly this winter as General Winter is this time not on Russias side.
Sure, and winter is going to be kind to the Ukrainians. At least those that can heat their homes.
“The Russian attacks on energy infrastructure have left Ukrainian civilians in a dire situation, as millions are without power, heat, and water.”
If one believes what Col. Douglas McGregor states, Russia has amassed over 500,000 troops ready to move on Ukraine as soon as the ground freezes to finish off the war. We shall see soon.
500K troops of the most advanced and highly capable Army in the world. That will definitely end this war by February.
No, it’s probably going to be a slow grind because big arrow operations are too costly in terms of human lives. It think by summer we should see a little clearer unless Kyiv decides to spare us all the pain and do the sensible thing by capitulating.
That’s exactly why Ukraine did it. Kyiv tries to provoke Russia into an unproportionable response that’ll give Nato a pretext for getting involved even more than it is already. Kyiv needs to trigger WW3 or the game is up. I think the Russians are wise enough not to go into this trap.
Russia has not touched any NATO member but NATO has been involved to provoke Russia actively in this war from the beginning, in fact they made this war even possible by using Ukraine as proxies.
True, Russia has been very careful to avoid escalation, even when the Americans assisted damaging the Moskwa flagship of the Russian Black Sea fleet. That’s exactly what the Ukrainians try to change by provoking the Russians into overreacting.
Reminds me of Russia in Syria when was asked for help by Bashar Al Assad. Hmm, I guess Zelensky did not ask NATO for support and given the Budapest Memorandum broken by one of its signatories (Russia), the West did not have any moral obligation to assist Ukraine either.
“” West did not have any moral obligation to assist Ukraine.””
Then why is the West, NATO, there, why do they fund the annihilation of Ukraine and the European economy?
Russia, the Europeans and the UN approved the signed agreements. For once get your facts right. The US was more or less neutral but silently supported the breaking of the agreement by the US approved UKRAINIAN GOVERNMENT.
Now the Ukrainians admit, they never intended to implement the agreements, they were used to buy time to arm and train with NATO. INFORM yourself, you really know nothing concerning the context of the crime committed on the Ukrainian people by their own government. Starting with the Obama/Biden coup.
You should read a little, start with Mearsheimer and Jeff Sachs and other people outside government and MSM. The info is available, you must look for it.
Go read the Memorandum and the leading causes to the the event of Maidan then reflect on the nonsense you just wrote.
If the government says so it must be so, they never lie. There is the Nuland phone call, no memorandum needed, it was never denied. And there are the videos where she hands out cookies to the people on the Maidan.
All the leading causes tell another story than you do.
1. The Syrian government is a Soviet/Russian ally, which the UK/US tried to topple with the help of terrorists. The Russians waited years before intervening to destroy the terrorists. I think the US might intervene if Russia tried to topple the Canadian government.
2. The Budapest Memorandum is a memorandum, in other words, a piece of paper and not a legally binding international treaty because the US Senate refused to ratify it.
3. Crimea was an independent Republic between 1991 and 1995, before Ukraine annexed it by force in 1995. Thus, the Budapest Memorandum of 1994 does not cover Crimea.
4. The US violated Ukraine’s sovereignty by toppling the elected president in a fascist coup in 2014.
5. There were no Russian troops in Ukraine prior to Feb. 24, 2022.
6. Russia invoked Chapter 5 of the UN Charter to assist the DNR and LNR against an attack the Kyiv regime launched on Feb. 16th, and also invoked the Responsibility to Protect R2P, established by Western powers for at least 30 years.
In conclusion, while the US violates every law in the book, the Russians are very careful about respecting international law.
CT, you have a way with words…
Russians have an almost instinctual reaction to threats to the motherland. It is to kill that threat at all costs. This developed over centuries of being invaded.
Question: were these bases part of the Russian strategic nuclear deterrent? I hope that no one is stupid enough to do something like an attack on such a base. If this is seen by Russia as a test on their defense of strategic assets, all bets are off.
Answer yes – in the sense that part of the nuclear deterrent was/is based there.
But attacking such a base is not going to justify a Russian nuclear response and thus is not stupid, as the bases were obviously legitimate targets – the Russians were launching attacks on Ukrainian infrastructure from these bases – if Russia does not want a base attacked then they should not carry out attacks from that base.
Frankly this is an exceptionally stupid response. My comment wasn’t about Ukrainian attack on this base. It was about the perception by the Russians that this was a test by NATO on how vulnerable this element of the Russian nuclear deterrent might be. In that regard, this action represented an significant escalation.
Perhaps you should have made this clear?
Given that it was a converted old USSR drone used it would be strange for them to assume/perceive this as a NATO test – for several reasons – first of them being that NATO has done a lot to avoid direct confrontation and second of them being that NATO would not use daylight drone strikes.
Well only if you are so unintelligent as to think the Russians are not aware that this was a Ukrainian strike.
STILL you don’t get it. Amazing.
I do you don’t – there is no way the Russians think this was anything other than a Ukrainian strike – if they did not want that kind of base targeted then they should not have been using it for attacks on Ukraine – and finally if you think that this increases the likelihood of a Russian strike on any NATO nation then you know nothing about the situation the Russians are in.
Another straw man argument.
What point is it that you are making that I have overlooked?
As far as I know, at least one of the bases was part of Russia’s strategic nuclear deterrent.
If the Ukrainians keep on trying to trigger a nuclear war, they may get lucky in the end, but not the rest of us.
“a…senior Ukrainian official…said Ukrainian forces were responsible.”
well duh, but…ignorant here – but wonder if drones are that easy to train to pilot remotely, and if – being remote – an experienced western drone operator not even in ukraine – with full western satellite intelligence support – wouldn’t have been been secretly used.
Are you absolute ignorant of the facts? – the drone used TU-141 is not remotely piloted but like the Shahed 136 preprogrammed to fly to its destination – technology that the Iranians possess is not out of reach for the Ukrainians. The left over of the drone would fall into the hands of the Russians and likely in a state where they could find out how it works – the western countries would not have used their ‘stuff’ or been part of this – as stated this tech is not out of what can be developed by the Ukrainians.
It’s actually an old Russian-built drone designed by Tupolev in Soviet times, which the Ukrainians must have dug out from some museum. The Ukrainians tried to use one of them in April, but instead of flying to Russia, it flew in the opposite direction and landed in Zagreb, Croatia.
So, targeting isn’t all that easy. In the latest case, the Ukrainians must have had US help to identify the target.
That’s why Washington is getting so nervous about Ukraine dragging the US into a direct war with Russia. The Pentagon even went to the unusual step of leaking that it had modified the HIMARS systems it had sent to Ukraine so that long range missiles could not be fired into Russia.
Edit: The Russians claim that it was a private US satellite (Maxar) that helped with the targeting. That could mean that the Russians may decide to destroy a private US satellite, which was involved in the war, and thus avoid hitting US forces directly. Since it’s fair game to kill a private mercenary fighting against you, it could also be fair game to destroy a private satellite used in the war.
Yes it is an old Soviet design – as you point out – one was already ‘lost’ in Croatia – that however was not a suicide drone but a ‘spy’ drone which got ‘lost’. The ones used now have been changed to carry explosives and not return.
No like for the Shahed 136 they only need the coordinates – yes they could have received them from the US but they could also have looked them up in google maps – that is about the precision required – the Iranians do not get coordinated from the US and they too could have hit it.
As pointed out if the Iranians can do it (and they can) so can the Ukrainians.
It is kind of funny that they think that Iranian equipment being able to hit a electric power station (about same precision needed) yet Ukrainian missiles needs much more precise information to basically still miss their targets – is it because they believe the individual planes were targeted? Given the technology involved (TU 141) I’d be surprised if it could exploit very precise information.
But admittedly if the Russians had actually moved the planes around from the latest and they thus were not at the latest location pointed out by commercially available satellite pictures then… but then it seems to be exactly what they are admitting to – i.e. not moving the planes so even the commercially available Maxar satellite pictures are enough!
In Google maps, you can’t see where a plane is parked at any given time, you also can’t see if a fuel depot is full or empty.
No exactly so you have to assume that they would be where there is the most oil on the ground – if you have seen the satellite pictures you can see that the bases are pretty much filled up – i.e. there are not all that many empty places on e.g. the Saratov.
So seeing as there is some delay on Maxar pictures the Russians are either filling up the base to such an extend that shifting the position does not solve their problem or they are being a bit lazy when it comes to shifting the position – probably the latter as they thought they were at a safe distance.
There is a fair bit of a delay to get the Maxar pictures and a fair bit of time to prepare the missiles for the strike and also about an hours flight time – so rather than escalate by trying to shoot down the Maxar they may just opt to shift the planes about or disperse them a bit – but that is just my guess as to how they could foil the next attack.
“Are you absolute ignorant of the facts? – the drone used TU-141 is not remotely piloted but like the Shahed 136 preprogrammed to fly to its destination – technol-”
Are you…not neurotypical? Seriously. It would explain a lot.
Why would my neuro type explain your ignorance – is it your claim that only neuro atypical persons would know this?
Why would yr neuro type explain my admitted ignorance?
But those are overly rigid categories – either it’s my admitted ignorance, or it’s how you think…
I don’t ask you to believe me…but – despite different pov’s – I don’t ask it unsympathetically…someone in my extended family, quite a few ‘high functioning’ students over years, with real intellectual strengths.
What put me onto it?…well for one, this fixation on single words – twice in a few days, just in posts w/me…where 1 word registers in yr brain only as ‘radically different’ vs ‘congruent w/a bigger idea.’ (altruistic, threshold).
And then how – despite my massive signposting – you could over-focus on one thing in one authority – completely ignoring the ‘large drop’ in ’99’ part in that text. And utterly fail to consider – even to disagree – other provided evidence.
See, it’s not that you were ‘wrong’ – or being obstructionist by micro-focusing – in any of the above…it’s genuinely how you think…
But then it is not just one word:
The whole comment implies that the Ukrainians would have to use a remotely piloted drone, rather than the actually simpler pre programmed system like the Shahed 136 – all, as I see it, to get to the conclusion that a western had to be involved – which would not be necessary with the preprogrammed system.
So convoluted reasoning (to arrive at a desired goal ?) when a bit of research would have gotten you to the insight that a Tu 141 or 143 was used and that this already had the kind of navigational system of the Shahed 136 that only had to be changed to allow for more precision.
So no need for vulnerable remote pilot systems (vulnerable to interference – which the preprogrammed system is much less vulnerable to if in doubt read up on the Shahed 136). This is why I ask you if it is that you think only a neuro atypical person would know this!
Shrug, not gonna press it, not gonna name it again in any other thread – and btw, I deliberately waited til this thread was dead, and thought about whether to raise it. 20+ yrs in ela classrooms, administering reading comp. assessments, evaluating students in classroom, working between literacy departments and individualized education plan groups and school psych depts, as autism ‘came on the radar’…unlike my ignorance of drone technology, rather confident of my instincts on this one, not to say I’m always right. What I’m not sure of is whether the possibility has occurred to you. As w/students and parents – where there are both academic and social questions at stake – my view is knowledge is preferable. Best.
As I don’t have a diagnosis, it’s not clear I do have a child with autism though – so I cannot tell you whether your instincts are wrong – it is not that I care all that much, but as people often look for reasons to reject the opinions of people that do not agree with I tend not to answer such questions.
Fair enough on all points. Perhaps doesn’t matter so much w/adults – hard to set aside prof. reading habits. I have to say I was disarmed by yr openness – this seems a relatively civilized website, but still. Welp, back to the battlefield, and some rather pressing life cares. Now, we might sing carols across no man’s land…but other than that…this meeting never happened.…..
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