UPDATE (11/11/22 2:00pm):
Russia says they have completed the withdrawal from Kherson.
Ukraine’s defense minister said Thursday that Russia will need at least a week to withdraw from the southern Ukrainian city of Kherson and remove all of its forces from the west bank of the Dnieper River.
“It’s not that easy to withdraw these troops from Kherson in one day or two days. As a minimum, [it will take] one week,” Ukrainian Defense Minister Oleksii Reznikov told Reuters.
Reports on Thursday said that Russia began withdrawing from some areas in the Kherson Oblast as Ukrainian forces were taking control of villages in the region. Reznikov said there were still Russian troops in and around the city of Kherson, which will likely be the last area that Russia withdraws from.
The Ukrainian defense chief said he expects fighting will slow in the winter. “The winter will slow down every activity on the battlefield for all sides … It’s beneficial for all sides. You will have a rest,” he said. “We will use this time with a maximum result for our armed forces, for regrouping, for refreshing, and for rotation and we will prepare them well.”
Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff Gen. Mark Milley, the highest ranking US military officer, said Wednesday that a winter slowdown in fighting could provide an opportunity for peace talks between Ukraine and Russia. The Italian newspaper La Repubblica reported this week that the US and NATO might think peace talks are possible if Ukraine retakes Kherson.
While there may be a slowdown in fighting, Russia could also be preparing for a major offensive as it has been reinforcing other positions after mobilizing 300,000 fresh troops. But Russia has also maintained that it’s open to negotiations.
The retreat from the west bank of the Dnieper marks the most significant Russian withdrawal since the war began on February 24, as it came after Moscow declared it had annexed the area. Russia had been evacuating civilians for weeks before announcing the withdrawal on Wednesday, and there were signs that troops would also be pulled out.
With Russia stating this is a regroup/repositioning of forces to The Donbas region, they’ll have to fight their way out as this is not a truce.
The Oracle has spoken.
I suspect the Russian commanders will be pleased if the Ukrainians foolishly commit more irreplaceable troops and equipment. They’ve already lost very large numbers of the former and quantities of the latter in a long series of failed assaults in Kherson.
Im not not sure the russian commanders will be pleased. Russia is very likely losing more soldiers and equipment daily. The Ukrainians are holding them and/or pushing them back almost everywhere in the frontlines with less soldiers and better modern warfare skills. And they will continue pushing East. Russia is set to lose more ground. I know this hurts your feelings but it’s a reality.
Failed assaults?
Well, all those “failed” assaults turned out to produce great results and achieved the short term objectives.
Weren’t you claiming couple months ago Ukraine was doomed and would not take Kherson?
You live in a fantasy world as far as this war is concerned, Don. You have lots of company, of course, because the Mass Western Brainwashing Campaign™ has been amazingly effective.
This is reality: Ukraine is losing irreplaceable troops and equipment fighting for pieces of real estate that Russia is willing to trade for a favorable clobber list in its war of attrition. Russia is in the process of organizing perhaps ten or more divisions to join forces already in Ukraine and the recently-annexed areas.
It probably would have been smarter if Russia had not established the right-bank bridgehead early in the fighting. That area is extremely difficult to hold because there have never been adequate river crossings for logistics requirements and Ukraine has been damaging and destroying some of the few bridges there are/were*. Retreating to the left bank makes good sense tactically, and it’s a decision that creates political fallout at home and provides ammunition for the West’s information war. Of course, Russia is utterly hopeless when it comes to fighting the propaganda war anyway, but it doesn’t seem to care all that much.
I suppose I could have said, in some context, that Ukraine is doomed. In some ways, it almost certainly is. I have definitely said that Ukraine is being wrecked. That is, I think, indisputably the case. While you and your fellow cheerleaders for disaster are busy trumpeting triumphalist nonsense, Ukraine is struggling to keep the lights on and the houses at least warm enough for life safety. And it seems that will only be possible to the extent that Russia permits it.
* Ironically, Ukraine’s attacks on the bridges is going to make the Russian lines on the left bank even easier to defend.
I’ve been rooting for Ukraine since the beginning because im against Putin’s bullying policies oh its neighbors.
I might live in and fantasy but i have been right from the beginning about my confidence on Ukraine’s ability to bring the fight to Russia and push them farther East.
As far as cheerleading for Ukraine, yes. I have and im the minority but your comments and positions make you a Russian cheerleader too.
And what did you call Kiev’s bombing of the Donbas from 2014-2022 that left 14,000 people in the Donbas dead? Putin isn’t the “bully” here — he’s the only one coming to the aid of the Donbas.
I saw this funny poster several years ago. “Never try to teach a pig to sing. It doesn’t work, and it annoys the pig.”
Everything you wrote is a complete BS.
and EUROPE.
Then you were rooting for the West provoking, surrounding Russia the past 30 years. Da?
For most of the cheerleaders for US-UK-NATO-Ukraine, the crisis in Ukraine began less than a year ago.
Whatever you say.
West surrounding Russia? Lol
But you cheer on the wrong side.
RD makes a lot of sense. Hopefully, these are reasons why there actually are secret negotiations occurring, which Gen Milley’s recent statements perhaps indicate
By all accounts from reliable, independent journalists we know that the Russian military has done all it could to do as little harm to civilians as is possible. They do provide food and medical care to the population while Zelensky’s people have massacred Ukrainians calling them collaborators because they accepted help including food from Russian soldiers and much more. Ukrainians slaughtering Ukrainians. Soldiers and civilians were not allowed to surrender in the hopeless Mariupol situation, including women and children. It shows how ruthless Zelensky is, he may have just followed American orders, the people in charge, starting with Biden.
Let me guess — you’re getting your war news from CNN.
And from MSNBC.
Where you get yours from? Perhaps you can share with me what real news about Ukraine come from.
It’s a troll. Block it.
I think you are misinformed about the reality of the situation, you think I am misinformed about the reality of the situation. I guess this has to keep going until everybody can agree on what the reality is. I wonder how much heavy weaponry was left behind.
Nothing was left behind it, was not an unorganized retreating army. They took care helping civilians to get out first then the military left.
https://news.yahoo.com/street-parties-underway-ukraine-liberates-141645506.html
Kherson is now in the hands of Ukraine.
Im happy for the people of Kherson City. Truly liberated.
Wonder if putin will keep it annexed and try a counter offensive in, say, 5 years? 🤷🏽♂️
Putin will never give up.
Most likely, Russia will never give up. It undertook this fight because it believes that is what is required in response to an existential threat from the US-NATO-puppet-Ukraine. Humans, and other life forms, don’t tend to give up in the face of existential threats.
Cornering critters who can fight back is a batshit-crazy-stupid move, unless, of course, you want to fight — to the death..
Its true, they have been trying to expand westwards for centuries
Ha.
The neocons believe they can win where Hitler failed.
Is it all about the liberation of Ukrainians now? When did that happen?
Biden said he wants regime change and a weak Russia, he never mentioned liberation. Some time ago it was all about NATO membership.
Having read quite a few comments from various sources about this, I am cautiously optimistic that this might turn out to be a good thing.
The official announcements that I am seeing are almost all about less kinetic war and more economic and cultural decoupling. Oh Western Ukraine can continue to lob missiles into Eastern Ukraine / Russia, but at some point this will be seen more as terrorist activity and less like acceptable military action. They will stop when internal polls show that these attacks hurt America’s image more than they help it.
It is looking like the global economic damage of the war and of the sanctions have overshadowed the kinetic war. For the US, defeating Russia at the cost of a complete economic meltdown would not be seen as a very good victory. The US economy is not doing well, and Europe’s seems to be doing worse. Getting Western Ukraine up to the economic standards of Afghanistan will cost either the US or EU 10s of billions of dollars over the next few months, with recurring charges moving forward. The recent expansion of the economic war against China via chip sanctions will cause dislocations in the Chinese economy – and in the economies of the US, EU, Japan, South Korea, and probably quite a few other nations as well.
I am cautiously optimistic that the only news items that we will hear about Ukraine until say March will be reports about how our awesome new air defense or drones or wonder weapon will defeat the Russians in spring, and other reports about how we need to spend more on military to counter whatever the Russians are claimed to be doing. Basically advertisements for more military spending. Still – a 3 month reprieve would be nice 🙂
Russia has been requesting negotiations since last December. Last December! The senile fool with the aviator glasses sees this as his moment in history. No negotiations that are a compromise for that guy.
Except, wasn’t there an article that said the negotiations talk was a ruse to keep the gravy train coming in Europe? Ukraine used Minsk 2 as a delay tactic to get training and weapons.
I think the expectations are that war will possibly restart some time in the future.
MAYBE.
But it seems to me that the US has demonstrated that it can terrorize enough of the Russian infrastructure without nukes to make a Russian win worthless, and vice versa.
The non-nuclear version of MAD.
Russia won. They liberated Mariopul. Oops the US won. They liberated Kherson.
Time to rebuild. With luck, Kherson and Mariopul will be built back better than the US was. Rebuilding is expensive and hard work. I HOPE that one or both get rebuilt.
Or did you mean,
Russia was massing troops in December. That kind of negotiations?
No, massing troops was preparation for the action Russia felt it had to take if the US refused to negotiate seriously, as it had already refused for years, and years, and . . .
And here we are. And Ukraine is wrecked. And Europe is headed for a major recession. And Germany is being deindustrialized. And American hegemony is slip-sliding away.
And it was so easy to see what was coming. Well, for some of us. It really should have been easy for everyone. But no.
USA/NATO were arming and training Ukrainians since the regime change in 2014. The NATO and Ukraine did military exercises in Ukraine on a rotating basis making Ukraine a de facto NATO MEMBER. Some 10 military maneuvers were scheduled for 2022. Army Times did report it.
But the EU and NATO are beginning to crumble around him, the senile fool will be left naked, then what? It could turn into the economical and military suicide of the hegemon. The weaponized currency is under attack too, not a small issue.
Tiny amount of money for the US economy. Russia is screwed, if they had grabbed Kyiv in the first days we would have a certain amount of grudging admiration for them. That didn’t happen, they lost and now no reasonable plan B
The Russians lost? They do not want Kiev.
The amount of $$$ out there is a huge amount even for a big economy. Every $ is an IOU. the government will never ever pay off, but a huge devaluation is possible
You are a troll. I block trolls.
Sure, grab as much as you can and then negotiate, if that works it is a great idea.
Italy will stop military support to Ukraine. Looks like the alliance is starting to unravel as expected. Biden is good in making enemies, he is pretty successful doing that. Why Americans get hysterical when the chickens come home to roost beats me.
Italy deciding to not send any more weapons to Ukraine is a huge turnabout from when the PM was described as being ultra pro-Ukraine. This is one of many ways that Russia can win this. Europe has to stay behind the US on this for quite a while for the US to win.
A month or two ago when the US started its fall offensive, Americans made fun of Russia for building defensive trenches close to Russian territory, the idea being that if Russia is going to be advancing into Ukraine, why are they building defensive trenches behind even the current lines?
It seems that Russia has been preparing for this for at least two months. Finally some consistency behind all that Russia has been doing. The idea seems to have been to bait US/NATO forces directly to the front lines, which seems to have worked, and to retreat to a defensive line that they have been preparing for at least the last two months. So Putin has two chances to win. Russia just flat out defeats US/NATO when the US decides to attack, or enough EU nations drop out before an attack even happens. Either way Russia has very short supply lines and very prepared positions.
Prognosis for the future? Nothing happens until the US decides to attack. It would happen at the timing and convenience of the US.
Where did you get the idea that ‘Italy will stop military support to Ukraine‘ from?
European reports as well as some you tube news reports including Chinese News. Do you know that 12 CEOs from big German corporations like BASF and Siemens and other big names traveled with Scholz to China? It is all about business. The war party, the Greens, did not like it.
The reports from Italy i.e. from the new government tells a very different story, so
https://www.euronews.com/my-europe/2022/11/10/italy-is-fully-committed-to-ukraine-support-meloni-tells-nato-chief
https://www.euractiv.com/section/politics/news/meloni-confirms-italys-commitment-to-nato-and-ukraine/
So not having seen your sources it is difficult to judge just why you would claim that this is the exact opposite of what Meloni is saying to the cameras on November 10’th 2022.
As for the relocation of the energy heavy industries – that will continue as long as we in EU apply high fees on their CO2 pollution and place no such fees on the same products when importing them from non EU countries. I.e. this was on its way before the invasion of Ukraine and would continue even if EU was to bend the knee to Putin.
Are you kidding? The USA spends close to a trillion dollars a year, year in and year out to protect ourselves against the “Russians” instead a one time payment of 20 billion and some motivated Ukrainians and the “Russian” problem is solved for a generation or more. It is a huge bargain. The amount of money we have spent in Ukraine is a rounding error on the Pentagons budget it is almost nothing.
In theory this means that when US/NATO makes its big push into Russia we will roll over them. We did not roll over much of them in the last offensive – they still control somewhere around 15% of Ukraine’s original territory plus Crimea. If we decide to try – and that is not guaranteed (my hope is we do not as it reduces the odds of nuclear war), the kinetic war will likely be a Shock and Awe War, both ways, and not a scaled back SMO.
Make fun of the idea of “SMO” vs “War” if you wish. I like the fact that no nukes, or even hyper-sonic missiles, have landed in US territory.
Um, no NATO troops are involved, no NATO navies no NATO airforces we are giving the Ukrainians some older systems but not even the best stuff. This is not NATO v Russia this in Russia v Ukraine with a tiny tiny assist from NATO.
Although it’s too early to be sure, it is beginning to look as if Zelensky has decided to allow Russia to withdraw from the west bank of the Dnipro without attempting to storm the Russian forces still in Kherson.
There are rumors that negotiations have taken place, and that this relatively peaceful withdrawal is one of the outcomes. I speculate that Russia has withdrawn its threat to Mykolaiv (protecting 35% of Ukraine’s grain exports), and that Ukraine has withdrawn its threat to the Kakhovka dam (protecting the cooling pond at the nuclear plant at Enerhodar and the North Crimean Canal that provides fresh water to Crimea).
If such an agreement has occurred, it may have the potential to resolve the conflict in the Kherson Oblast. Perhaps both sides have come to realize that a compromise is better than a Pyrrhic victory. Wouldn’t that be nice.
ttps://www.rt.com/russia/566332-kherson-region-withdrawal-update/
Zelensky “allowed”? That corrupt clown isn’t in any position to “allow” anyone anything. Even the US is bypassing him in its covert peace talks with the Saudis and Turks. Zelensky will be told what to do, as he has been since February.
The dam at the Dnieper has been damaged and is leaking. The Russians were worried that the Ukraine (Kiev) forces would do such a thing, and risk the city and Russian soldiers. The Ukraine flag was not raised by persons sympathetic to the separatists, but to Kiev. During “peacetime” expect shelling by Kiev at the Donbas.
Ukrainian Zelensky and Azov people can’t be trusted, no more than Biden and his neocon handlers can be trusted.
Yes and No. As you say, the infrastructure tangle presents a nightmarish Gordian Knot; but, the problem of Minsk I & II is still very fresh, along with the nazi-fication of Washington/Kiev; and, just how you can make a deal with such types until they are seriously and permanently weakened … ? … still, if someone exists who can, his name is Lavrov.
I don’t think the war is over. But it may be over in Kherson, and there are key factors that were not present in the Minsk agreements. It will be Russia, not an independent republic, that Ukraine would be fighting if the incursions continue. The Dnipro River is a formidable barrier, especially against infantry. Although the US is still maintaining appearances that Ukraine is calling the shots, this withdrawal would not have happened without US insistence.
The prospect of Kiev taking out the dam is the fear.
From my reading of history, aside from commercial, the symbolic significance of Kherson as the matrix of Russian Orthodox culture is too great to be surrendered into the hands of Nazis, a profanation that the pious, including most notably Putin himself, would never forgive.
Good to know. Do you think the mass evacuation of civilians might create a “new” Kherson?
I don’t think you can create a new Sacred Ground. But, if peace were possible by conceding the west bank, perhaps a Vatican City type autonomous polis, or some such arrangement, as it’s just as sacred to Ukraine??
Milley and the Ukrainians probably didn’t get the memo — the Russians have completed their pullout. Contrary to Ukraine’s “stay and fight to the death even though it’s hopeless” policy, the Russians care about their soldiers and will not expose them to unnecessary danger.
“Russians care about their soldiers” There are between 30,000 to 60,000 parents in Russia that may not believe that.
I would bump that number up to over 200k + with the casualties and add spouses.
GioCon sounds just like General Igor Konashenkov. Pulling info out of his ass and expenting everyone believes him.
Russians don’t waste their soldiers the way Zelensky wastes Ukrainian soldiers and civilians. There is no Russian Mariupol but there is a Zelensky/Biden Mariupol.
There are also lots of reports and evidence of massacres committed by Ukrainian troops against Russian speaking Ukrainians which go unreported by the western MSM. The reports about Russian soldiers raping Ukrainian women have turned out to be fake propaganda that too the media will not report. There is much more.
“Russians don’t waste their soldiers the way Zelensky wastes Ukrainian soldiers and civilians”
I stopped reading after this line. Ridiculous.
I understand, the truth does hurt.
But you got the memo long time ago. You could’ve shared that with us.
Your news source is super accurate. I envy you.
You are ready to join the Russian Army. Go, they’ll take good care of you.
That is a cheap way to respond, usually it happens when there is nothing to say.
You are right. Nothing to say to that nonsense.
It’s a troll.
Evacuation from left bank started when there was talk about Kiev regime using dirty bomb. So that is at least few weeks ago.
When Kremlin made the public announcement about ‘difficult decisions’ that means evacuation of personal, equipment and civilians was already complete. They wouldn’t make it if they were still evacuating.