The Washington Post reported Tuesday that there are divisions between NATO members over the alliance’s plans to expand its military presence in Eastern Europe.
Poland and the Baltic states are seeking a significant expansion of NATO’s presence on their territory, while other NATO members, including France and Italy, are hesitant and don’t think Russia threatens alliance territory.
The Post obtained a confidential proposal from Latvia, Lithuania, and Estonia that asks for a contingent of 20,000 troops to be put on standby to deploy to their territory if they come under attack.
Under the proposal, a brigade of 6,000 NATO troops would be deployed to each Baltic country, up from the roughly 2,000 NATO soldiers that were there before February. The plan would also station military equipment for the 20,000 troops on standby to use if they are activated.
“Russia’s direct military aggression against NATO allies cannot be excluded,” the proposal reads. “Russia can rapidly mass military forces against NATO’s eastern border and confront the Alliance with a short war and fait accompli.”
The Post report said Eastern European countries are also pushing for the alliance to abandon the NATO-Russia Founding Act, an agreement signed in 1997 that called for cooperation between Moscow and NATO. Under the deal, NATO agreed not to permanently station troops east of Germany.
Most NATO members agree that Russia violated the Founding Act by invading Ukraine, but officials in Western Europe and the US are hesitant to abandon the deal altogether.
Since the beginning of the year, the US has deployed tens of thousands of troops to bolster its forces in Europe, including in Poland and the Baltic states, and US military leaders are eyeing a more permanent presence.
In April, Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff Gen. Mark Milley said the US’s allies in Eastern Europe could build new permanent military bases that US troops could rotate through. He said the Baltic states, Poland, and Romania are “very, very willing” to establish such bases. “They’ll build them, they’ll pay for them,” he said.
50 thoughts on “NATO Members at Odds Over Buildup in Eastern Europe”
“They’ll build them, they’ll pay for them,” he said.
Liar. I hope that if anything good comes out of this mess it will be the dissolution of NATO. It should have stood down after the Warsaw Pact did.
They’ll “donate” surplus tents that they originally received from the US in the first place so our troops will have somewhere to sleep. And we’ll say “Thank You”.
We don’t know the whole truth. Germany is funding the American occupation of Germany with big sums, but the people are never told, same as we are never told how much we really pay for the CIA and all its contracts. There are hidden budgets, always additional costs like the $40 billion they just approved after all the others and more to come. They tell us lies all the time.
I hope so too, a think a little voice tells me that it will be the end of NATO, no matter what, also the end of the EU, but then where will they go from there? Yes, there is China and India. The world outside NATO supports Russia and Putin and many people inside NATO do too. So far there is manipulated public support, which could change by fall when the consequences hit them.
Croatia also is opposed to the Finland and Sweden membership. There are cracks in NATO, the nations don’t like to be used as proxies, when they find out that is what they are, what will happen then? The US is a brutal hegemon, that can’t end well.
WAPO is WACKO.
It’s essentially Russians (ukies) tricked and pitted against Russians in the ukraine, so Russia does this with a heavy heart, hence the slow pace. Against the western fascist regimes behind Nato, who has no idea what it is to be on the recieving end in a war like this, it’s a totally different ballgame, which they’re about to experiance pretty soon. They have to repeat this every time their amnesia from their latest defeat kicks in, every 80 years or so but as Putin said, never again. Next war won’t be fought on Russian soil.
Heavy hearts don’t win wars, just bleed.
The Baltics and Poland are beggar nations, that cry, cry, cry, and demand, demand, demand, but pay for nothing. NATO never should have let them in, because they add nothing; they are as useless to “common defense” of NATO as they were to the Warsaw Pact. The ONLY reason we put up with them in the first place is that Bush 2 was able to bribe them into supporting his war in Iraq, and thus make the claim that they represent “new Europe”. Because the 4 soldiers and a dog that the Baltics contributed were so helpful in Anwar. Long past time to tell these welfare queens to go pound salt.
Poland was actually the only military Warsaw pact member besides the USSR with offensive potential. When I lived there my Polish friend’s dad had been a paratrooper, and their mission was to conquer Denmark.
Poland was also the only country that ever defeated the USSR in a war. They are excellent soldiers.
Not a criticism of the Poles as soldiers, or the Balts, but of their governments. The “Migs for Ukraine” deal is a perfect example; Poland got those Migs, from Germany, who inherited them from East Germany, who got them second hand from the USSR. Poland paid Germany 1 euro per aircraft. The aircraft were, at that time, on their last legs; Germany had flown them extensively in “non-peer air combat” training and they were going to be retired and scrapped. The Poles have spent little, if anything, to keep them airworthy; they only keep them on their strength in order to maintain the pretense that they actually “have” an airforce.
So this was an enormous scam; Poland will graciously “give” a handful of 40 year old aircraft they paid nothing for, to Ukraine, but ONLY if the USA gives them “replacement” F-16 fighters for FREE. Of course, these are aircraft that, if Poland was serious about living up to their NATO commitment, they would have been buying for years. But they refused to pay; because again, “beggar nation”.
ALL the NATO countries are giving Ukraine their junk, including USA.
ALL the NATO countries are giving Ukraine their junk, including USA.
Well, not really; Germany, and to a large extent, the USA, is primarily backfilling the stocks of the eastern NATO countries giving their old soviet junk to Ukraine .That “$40 Billion” US package is full of pork for US arms makers, not so much for Ukraine.
So the beggar partners get upgraded (but not new), NATO compatible equipment that they refused to pay for since they joined NATO, in exchange for ex-Soviet junk, which is almost certainly of limited capability. In exchange, the US and Germany dump retired, older model equipment onto the beggar partners, and then buy brand new, top-of-the line equipment from their own weapons makers, to “replenish their stocks”.
Just as illustration; Kraus-Maffei investigated giving upgraded Leopard 1 tanks to Ukraine; this equipment has almost certainly been far better maintained than the junk Poland and Slovakia are “donating”, but even by that standard, the Germans estimate all those tanks would need extensive refurbishing (up to 5 weeks) before they would be combat ready; what do you think the status of the “stored” T-72s that Slovenia acquired when they were abandoned in the field by the then-Yugoslav Army are? I doubt they could even roll across the border under their own power.
I don’t know why you lump in Poland with a country like Slovakia (you mistakenly said Slovenia). Slovakia has little industry, while Poland manufactures a lot of it’s own military equipment, upgrades it’s old Soviet equipment, and has build hundreds of new, modernized versions of the T-72 (which is all that the Russian T-72B3’s are). Also, their Mig-29 fleet is NOT in storage, and that plane is no worse than older models of the F-16.
No. I didn’t mistakenly say “Slovenia”. SLOVENIA is the country that scooped up 30-odd ex Yugo T-72s abandoned (not “turned over”) by the Yugoslav Army, towed them into “storage” (probably inside a leaky barn) and let them sit for near 30 years before generously “donating” them to Ukraine, in exchange for FREE German Marder IFVs. Am=nd Polands Mig-29s were not fully flyable when they bought them from Germany; the Germans were going to scrap them as beyond their useful life, after several very intense years of service as “aggressor trainer” aircraft. Poland doesn’t have the money (or won’t spend it) to maintain that fleet.
When did they defeat USSR in war?
Poland always makes same mistakes. In WWII itcwas charmed by UK into alliance, got into quarrel with both Gerany and USSR, and ended up being crushed.
Always lunching above its weight.
Look up the Soviet-Polish war. It was around 1919-1922. They destroyed an entire Russian field army, and the USSR sued for piece, ceding vast swaths of territory to the Poles.
UK needed a foot on the continent, encircling Germany was the goal then and Poland provided that handle, much like Ukraine is used for now against Russia, Finland would close the other opening up north.
Easy way for Russia to cost western NATO countries a ton of money: just station troops and bases close to the Baltics and watch them demand tens of thousands of soldiers permanently stationed there, costing billions a year for no security benefit to their home countries. Should clarify for the Germans, Spanish, Italians etc. what this is all about.
It’s understandable that some members apart from the Baltic and polish prostitutes are hesitant or totally against because they know the real score:
Russia using only 8% of its overall military force has taken a territory the size of England from Ukraine in 3 months.
Ukraine – one of NATO’s biggest armies, albeit not officially a part of NATO – is being supported by the whole western world and keeps losing.
That western world is only a part of the globe, the rest of the world is so much bigger than all NATO members combined and they support Russia. NATO is not a solid partner, the US made sure for that.
And Russia is holding its own against NATO. Thumps up for Russia.
Ukraine is also losing very slowly and vary large. This is a war of attrition.
The West is more concerned with developments off the battlefield, where they have been soundly beaten this round by Russian diplomacy and economics in the non-Western world.
Over-extension is a common military error, while drawing an opponent into over-extension is an important military strategy.
Russia holds where they were concentrated in force. The more of Ukraine they take, the more they rely on having Ukrainian allies.
Russia eventually had to withdraw from the entire northern front, and abandon Mykolaiv oblast on the southern front.
On the eastern front, half of Kharkiv oblast west of the Donets river had to be ceded to the Russian border. There’s no point fighting for Khariv city, as the Kharkiv experimental nuclear reactor is mined by Ukraine.
Russia also can’t spare the troops to occupy Ukraine’s second largest city, and if they had taken Kharkiv, odds are the war would look very different.
Lugnask was mostly overrun by Russian forces, suggesting the AFU there were an attack force waiting to sweep south into separatist Donbass and not oriented to defense.
However, the contact line has hardly moved in Donetsk, and NATO-led Ukraine troops are eluding cauldroning.
This war is far from over, with some Western leaders expecting/wanting hostilities to last into fall and winter.
Hard to say anything really since we don’t know sh*t and only can speculate what Russia is up to and are as clueless as Nato a and the Pentagram in this regard and they’ve been wrong all the time.
Knowing or not intentions, is not the same as experiencing the effects of actions regardless of intent.
The Wiki has one of the best war maps going. The Russians have lost huge chunks of their original occupied space, and are barely advancing on the remaining space.
We all experience the economic effects of this war.
Its not so bad in North America yet, but many ordinary Europeans have limited fuel to stay warm or operate their businesses and transportation.
Anti-Russia sanctions depressed the Western COVID recovery and abetted the WEF Reset, there may even be food shortages later in the year.
Russians can’t eat at MacDonalds or buy Western luxury goods… heck, that’s saving money.
Well, that would certainly deter the dastardly Russians from attacking. 😏
It has a purpose though. There is a meeting of minds though there. Russophobic element n US war party is strong. It hails from old East Euopean entanglements going back to Middle Ages, always reheated by British Emoire for its divide and conquer needs.
Nothing mew here, except that American nation has no reasin whatsoever to get micro-involved in Europe. US is a glibal power, so is Russia and China. These are US peers and one negotiates with peers to maintain the balance of powers, while advancing economies and development.
Instead, US is acting like a third rate power that is keen in controlling Europe — whike pokungvat Russia using all former Nazi resources. Baltic states and Finland were Hitler.’s allies and his rear guard when withdrawing frim Soviet Union. Now they see a chance for a revenge. With mighty US takungvup their cause.
Sure it is annoyance to Russia. But to think that someone woukd actually di harm to Rusdian cities near by and not suffer imediate retaliation — is dreaming.
But the stories of Russian military being weak have a purpose. To prevent Western population being afraid of nuclear war, affraid of Russia,
Even a conventional war would turn the continent in scorched earth and put the nations on the same level with Iraq, Syria, Libya and so many other countries, Europe would be like the ME. Apparently Finland and Sweden want to dance with the devil too. Have fun.
I think any war between Russia and Nato would go nuclear pretty quickly. The difference in power between Nato and Russia is just too big. The nuclear force is the big equalizer.
NATO consists of 30 members three of them are nuclear powers and they still can’t destroy Russia, the real goal. Biden still travels the world to threaten consequences to nations if they don’t support him. It is Biden’s war, Russia is fighting a defensive war. Biden and Austin said so, finally we can call a spade a spade. Kudos to Russia regardless of how it might end, lets hope they win, America has become a monster hegemon and has to be stopped. We can forget the suicided European NATO members. Stupid Swedes and Fins take the cake, but they may just be paid traitors of their countries.
True! It’s a proxy war against Russia with the stated aim of “weakening” (or preferably destroying) the Russian Federation.
Senators Lindsey Graham and John McCain explained this to Ukrainian troops in the presence of president Poroshenko in special slow English so that nobody should miss the point.
That’s 6 years before the Russian incursion into Ukraine.
The US uses hybrid warfare. Actually attacking Russian cities with US forces would be the absolutely last means envisioned. Before that, there are plenty of means to undermine the Kremlin’s rule and destabilize or destroy the Russian Federation. It’s regime change by any means possible. For example, the color revolutions or supporting dissidents like Navalny are just some of a wide range of regime change strategies. Right now, the US is tightening the Nato noose around Russia. If they can’t have Ukraine for now, they’ll settle for Finland and have another go at Ukraine later. The US wants Ukraine because Ukrainians are more eager to station US nukes on their soil than the Finns.
So, when are the members of NATO going to admit that they had a major hand in the creating the current mess? Over the 30 years of encirclement of Russia, didn’t it occur to them that there may be consequences?
Sure, just like Zelensky what can America do for you today. Don’t have the money to defend your own country?
How about America just sends each of your countries $40 billion each and each an aircraft carriers worth $13 Billion each.
The American economy is about to enter hyperinflation and a depression but we will just print more money just for you.
The War Party is eager to make much of Europe a wasteland. And don’t forget 10% for the big guy
If all goes well, Russia will be weakened, Putin toppled in favour of an Atlanticist puppet, and full attention returned to war with China minus their strongest ally.
NATO is still playing divide-and-conquer in the Eurasian century.
Yes that’s the war party’s grand strategy. Wondering what finally stops the war party ? They’ve been failing consistently for 30 years now – yet still have all the power in Washington.
“Failure” implies a goal that isn’t met.
The goal of the war party is to transfer as much wealth as possible from the productive class to the political class via “defense” spending.
Vis a vis its goal, the war party has been succeeding consistently since about 1940.
Roosevelt did not wish war,he feared Germany and its engineering skills Hitler declared war on the US,not vice versa.Perhaps US biases underestimated Japan.The USN for the most part,seems to have been asleep.The army was miniscule. Isolation was rampant,but people knew of the Axis rapine.
Indeed the goal is a rousing success. Imagine how much vigorish $40billion buys. Will even 10% reach Kiev ?
The only thing stopping the War Party has been Russian interference and the War Party’s own ineptitude.
Though as far as looting public treasuries go, Russia has been a tremendous help in Ukraine, to build on Mr. Knapp’s comment.
Even then, the Russians may yet prevail by simply making the Ukraine War too costly.
The US stock market has already more or less crashed and will probably crash further. Some may want this to happen, but no economy means nothing in the treasury to loot but empty zeros.
Even the Saudis have pulled cash out of US in-securities. Russian sanctions graphically demonstrated there is no right to property anywhere in the West.
…, sanctions graphically demonstrated there is no right to property anywhere in the West…
This is the most profound takeaway of the Ukraine conflict. De-dollarization is going to accelerate now.
There will be a reduction in how much money foreign nations keep in US banks or as currency reserve, or as property, but they’ll keep using US dollars at least to the degree that they need to settle in US dollars.
Investors will simply factor in the risk, becoming more ready to pull out and keeping cash in other currencies.
Its harder on smaller Western currencies that are minor reserve currencies like the Canadian dollar.
De-dollarization has been a steady and gradual phenomenon for a few years, now it will slightly accelerate. De-dollarizationwill take 3-7 years to become a big topic.
We‘ll see most of the world by geography move to non-dollar settlement for trade
Poland has been falling all over itself to facilitate the war between the US and Russia. It comes as no surprise that they are getting worried about retaliation. I wonder if Finland and Sweden realize that the motivation to bring them in has more to do with defending Poland than it does with NATO defending them.
I think they do know, their leaders are traitors to their nation as are all the other NATO MEMBERS. they provide the cannon fodder to protect American interests.
NATO the biggest alliance with the most expensive equipment and biggest budgets ever, 3 nuclear powers, and still they can’t handle Putin, they still need more of everything. Why does NATO need Sweden and Finland as members? Did Russia threaten them, when why and where? Why do two neutral nations need NATO? Please Biden owes us an explanation. Biden did say the Ukraine is no threat to Russia, which is true, but NATO is threatening Russia, Biden said, he wants regime change, replace the elected President Putin with some flaky scum like a Navalny his liking, someone like the neo-Nazi replacement in Kiev in 2014. And he wants to weaken Russia, reduce it to a third world country.
Biden is just evil, he wants more war and to hell with the people.
The US wants total world domination. Russia is one obstacle on the way for achieving that objective that the US wants to eliminate.
Biden doesn’t war so much as war is part of a greater agenda, likely the Europe First WEF Reset to start, but also to remove Russia so China can be dealt with.
That’s a classic disinformation to pull the woolies over the eyes of the Western public. The US violated the Russia-Nato Founding Act of 1997 by stationing missile systems in Romania and Poland in addition to unilaterally cancelling the INF treaty. Russia invaded Ukraine exactly because Nato violated the Founding Act to threaten Russia by moving Nato infrastructure closer to Russia’s border. That Nato lied about it doesn’t make it any better.
The West always blames Russia for its own sins.
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