European officials on Tuesday said massive leaks in the Nord Stream natural gas pipelines that were caused by explosions were likely the result of sabotage, raising questions on who the culprit might be.
The Nord Stream pipelines connect Russia to Germany via the Baltic Sea. Russia recently stopped shipping gas through Nord Stream 1 indefinitely, and the construction of Nord Stream 2 has been completed, but the pipeline has never been fully operational as Berlin suspended the project around the time Russia invaded Ukraine.
Two leaks were discovered in Nord Stream 1, and one leak was discovered in Nord Stream 2 after the operator reported a sudden drop in pressure overnight Monday. While neither pipeline has been delivering to Europe, both contain gas under pressure.
Two underwater explosions were recorded earlier on Monday near the Danish island of Bornholm in the Baltic Sea, which is where the leaks occurred. Nord Stream AG, the operator of the pipelines, said it was not possible to estimate when the damage could be fixed.
EU, Swedish, Norwegian, and Danish officials all said the damage was likely caused by a deliberate attack. Over in Moscow, Kremlin spokesman Dmitry Peskov said that sabotage could not be ruled out.
Radek Sikorski, a former Polish foreign minister and current Member of European Parliament, suggested on Twitter that Washington was behind the attack. He posted a picture on Twitter of the disturbance in the water caused by the leaks and wrote, “Thank you, USA.”
In another tweet, Sikorski, who is married to American journalist Anne Applebaum, described his view that the US was responsible as a “hypothesis.” He also celebrated the attack, saying that “$20 billion of scrap metal lies at the bottom of the sea, another cost to Russia of its criminal decision to invade Ukraine.”
According to a report from Germany’s Der Spiegel, the US had foreknowledge of a possible attack on the pipelines. Citing unnamed sources, Spiegel reported that the German government received a tip over the summer from the CIA that Nord Stream could be attacked, and Berlin assumed both pipelines could be targeted.
The Nord Stream 2 pipeline has long been in the crosshairs of Washington and the US had tried to stop its construction by imposing sanctions. Before Russia invaded Ukraine on February 24, President Biden said the US would “bring an end” to the Nord Stream 2 pipeline.
When asked how the US could end the pipeline since it’s in Germany’s control, Biden said, “I promise you, we will be able to do that.” Back in January, Under Secretary of State for Political Affairs Victoria Nuland made similar comments. “If Russia invades Ukraine, one way or another, Nord Stream 2 will not move forward,” she said.
Secretary of State Antony Blinken on Tuesday commented on the attacks on the pipelines, saying the damage was in nobody’s interest. “There are initial reports indicating that this may be the result of an attack or some kind of sabotage, but these are initial reports and we haven’t confirmed that yet,” he said. “But if it is confirmed, that’s clearly in no one’s interest.”
Ukraine accused Russia of being behind the incident, but Moscow has little reason to attack the pipelines. Earlier this month, Russian President Vladimir Putin said that if Europe wanted gas, it could open Nord Stream 2. “The bottom line is, if you have an urge, if it’s so hard for you, just lift the sanctions on Nord Stream 2, which is 55 billion cubic meters of gas per year, just push the button and everything will get going,” he said.
The attacks on Nord Stream coincided with the inauguration of the Baltic Pipe, another natural gas pipeline that will carry gas from Norway through Denmark to Poland. “The era of Russian domination of gas is coming to an end, an era marked by blackmail, threats and coercion,” Polish Prime Minister Mateusz Morawiecki said at a ceremony for the pipeline, which the EU says should start transporting gas on October 1.
I got to suspect the USA first and foremost on this one. Why would the Russians who control the spigot, have to blow up the pipeline that they own? Makes no sense to me whatsoever. The Europeans will want supplies to resume as soon as the situation in Ukraine resolves so they wouldn’t blow it either. The USA on the other hand benefits, we get to sell NG to the EU, plus it prevents our allies from going all wobbly during the coming winter as Russian gas is no longer an option.
Putin told recently that Russia is ready to supply the gas through Nord Stream 2 when Germany is ready for that. In Germany the pressure from the public for the exploitation of Nord Stream 2 was growing every day. American leadership was determined not to allow this to happen. They from the beginning were categorically against this project.
Biden just before Russia’s intervention in the Donbas last February when interviewed said” if Russia invades Ukraine there will be no Nord Stream 2.” When the reporter asked him how he is going to do that he remarked “we will find a way”. Russian gas is cheap, but USA wants to sell expensive LNG. Russia does not care. It is doing a roaring trade with China, India, Turkey and even to oil rich Saudi Arabia. Europeans will have to choose between eating or heating, their economies are collapsing.
It looks, by destroying the trade between Russia and EU, they tried to damage them both. As we can see now, the outcome is a bit different. EU is the main loser.
The US is the most obvious suspect.
Then again, a lot of commenters on this site seem to think that pretty much every attack everywhere is a “false flag.”
Strongly agree. Following the referendums, Biden has to decide if he wants to openly attack Russia. One factor will be to get buy in from Europe. Cutting the pipeline prevents Russia from dangling a carrot for a significant amount of time.
That is only because it is occasionally true…
These pipelines go a long way through the Baltic Sea. Why were the attacks near Denmark, hence also relatively close to Germany? I do not know but there has to be a reason for this.
The area where the sabotage happened is an indicator that it was a western operation.
On the other hand, it’s not like forces never pull special ops in enemy territory.
I can think of a few good reasons why the Russians might want to do something like this, with enough plausible deniability to cast doubt, but also not so much that nobody wonders.
One is to signal to Europe that they CAN do stuff like this, so that e.g. Olaf Scholz can have a good think about whether he’d like some more of it.
Another is to continue driving home the message that if you keep screwing with Russia you keep not getting the natural gas.
And a third is somewhat complex (I am not an engineer), but:
Even though Russia is not selling/pumping gas to Europe, the lines are kept pressurized. That probably makes sense for several reasons — less chance of a line collapse, less corrosion/oxidization, etc.
But there are ALWAYS leaks, which means gas has to be pumped into the lines to keep the pressure up.
What if e.g. Germany or Denmark have been stealing some gas out of those lines and relying on the Russians to keep the pumps on to maintain pressure? Not enough so it’s obvious, just enough that it’s “plausibly deniable,” but some?
If that’s the case, and if the Russians suspect it, I could see them blowing the lines so that they’re effectively saying “you want free gas? OK, here’s your free gas, bubbling up in the water. Good luck using it.”
That Russians know how to destroy a pipeline is a given, only there is no motivation to destroy their own pipeline, that too is a given. It is also true that all the Germans had to do was to open the spigots and the people started to demand just that, and voices in the congress came out loud and clear, two women had the courage to speak up, Wagenknecht, linke and Weidel, right AfD. Two promising women, thumps up for the two women, they can make mincemeat with the garbage the government represents. That government is the result of sham elections, the only explanation to have such garbage for government.
“It is also true that all the Germans had to do was to open the spigots”
No, that’s not all the Germans had to do.
The Germans also had to pay for the gas in usable currency. Lavrov was quite clear on that point.
And the mechanism for doing that had been set up with Gazprombank.
If anything, NATO can now step out and declare it quits with the USA. Who wants to be allied with the killer you know? What is it they have to lose when they say simply no? They have nothing to lose, they can only win and survive. That is the choice Europeans have. NATO membership is killing them for sure.
The Americans will throw Europe under the bus.
Call it what it is, the USA is the real enemy of Europe not Russia.
When Ukraine sent commandos across the river to the reactor at Zaporizhia, the Russians used artillery to eliminate them. So there is a tiny splinter of truth in the claims that Russia struck the grounds of its own facility. But why destroy your own pipeline when you can turn it off with the push of a button?
To be precise, the Ukrainians were nowhere near the actual reactors AFAIK.
There are NOT “aAlways leaks in high pressure systems like this one. Any leaks in a new high pressure pipeline like this NS one are quickly discovered in initial testing and quickly remedied. They are money leaks and dangerous. How many more CRACK POT ideas can Knapp dream up to try to obfuscate this dangerous op??
I suspect he can dream up many more. Never says a word about Ukrainian behavior, only Russia. But he doesn’t have the balls to admit he hates Russia. No intellectual integrity whatsoever, and intellectual cowardice to boot.
“Never says a word about Ukrainian behavior”
Liar.
There is no such thing as a high-pressure system with no leaks. Look at the high-pressure water circulation in nuclear reactors, which is about as sensitive as it gets — and there are constant leaks that contaminate ground water, which are the leaks big enough to be detected and bothered with.
That would make it a more effective warning that they could hit the new Baltic Pipe, without the overt escalatory step of doing it. I don’t think that is the highest probability, but it is the only way this makes sense if seen as a Russian operation.
It is also possible that Scholz was told in Feb. 2022, what was going to happen, Biden did say it at the press conference, when he took over answering the question about NS2 which the journalist had asked Scholz, weeks before the Russian military action would happen if they don’t do as told, Biden threatens, that is all he knows. Maybe that explains the stupidity of the German government. Biden knew at the beginning of Feb. 2022 of the SMO in Ukraine.
Russia delivered as agreed and the Germans paid as agreed, over decades there never was any disagreement, both sides honored kept their word.
The Ukrainians stole the gas from pipelines in Ukraine, that is well known, they are just corrupt.
It’s the shallowest section — 45-80 meters depth — easily accesible to seal team divers.
(But if you want to go with the ridiculous “The Russians did it!” also the easiest to repair.)
Also easiest depth in which to operate from a submarine bringing in a sabotage team, whether swimmers or minisub operated from it. However, it is dangerous for the larger sub to be in such shallow water.
Now, divers or ROV from a small surface craft? That would be safer, and almost certainly Western.
The intent of the thing seems to have been to “send a message,” else the damage would have been far worse.
The questions are:
1) Who’s sending the message?
2) Who are they sending the message to?
2) What IS the message?
If I was betting money, I’d bet that it’s the US (or possibly the UK) sending the message “don’t even think about capitulating on the energy sanctions because we’ll make sure that doesn’t work even if you try it” to Germany.
But there are other possibilities.
This is really a declaration of war against Germany, instigated by the Biden administration, the goal is to destroy the German economy, not for the first time, that happened with WW I , after that WWII and maybe now WW III will do it.
To think, your ally in bed with you turns out to be a snake.
And yes the German’s have the most stupid government ever, the Baerbock, Habeck, and von der Leyen, and Scholz are the most stupid people, it can’t get lower.
Johnson was no better, same is true of Truss and the USA has a senile old president and useless incompetent VP and Secretary of state Blinken, and Nuland and Sullivan. So despicable, how can that be possible, so much stupidity, garbage ?
They are the only suspect and they even told us more than a year ago. And the German sh**thead Scholz knew it when he stood there silently. Now there are reports that the CIA warned the Germans several times, was it threats or warnings?
I wonder how serious the damage is. It may be the Russians in that now half of EU suspects the Americans, if the damage is ornamental it might be worth it. War everybody is lying.
War everybody is lying, but everyone is not acting AGAINST their own interests. Follow the profit motive, not what they say…!!!!!!!
I’m not interested in conspiracy theories … conspiracy facts, however, …
sometimes it quacks like a duck.
9/11 comes to mind.
19 Saudis attacked us so we could go after Iraq? That is some subtle stuff.
They knew immediately who did it, Clinton had warned the Bush administration. But there are a lot of unanswered questions, and our governments have no credibility. They attacked Afghanistan first and then Iraq but all 19 attackers were Saudis and neither Iraq nor Afghanistan had anything to do with it.
I believe 15 were Saudi. The others were from UAE, Lebanon, Egypt. Money for the operation came from Saudi Arabia. Why would we do business with that Wahabist nation, a nation created by jihad?
Oil. The foundation of the world economy and of the US economy and the US dollar.
OIL The Wahhabis and the Salafists, strict orthodox extremist Sunni Muslim the USA used against the almost secular government like Syria, and Libya and the most orthodox, extremist Mujahidin Taliban in Afghanistan.
don’t forget afghanistan, we went after them too
Its only a false flag if the true perpetrators convincenly steer opinion that their enemy did what they actually nexecuted. Your usual sense seems to have departed and joined the MSM crew screaming Russia, Russia, Russia. Or at least obfuscating this not very murky situation. But in this case we have the BIDEN VIDEO confession & the Nuland “oblique one too. IT’S clearly MADNESS!!!!!!!!!!!! Bad tradecraft. too
There was Trump before, all administrations opposed the pipeline because the US corporations have fracking gas to sell. Get real, the info is even in the MSM all one has to do is to think logically, cui bono.
That is because there is a high number of true false flag incidence, including the shelling of the NPP. If the IAEA had any evidence that Russia did it , they would have said so, it would have been in the news 24/7.
The side the US supports, but it looks like a rogue action more likely to be by Poland or Ukraine, some nation on the extreme right in this war, with know special forces and nearby access.
Not sure, but that is the direction I’d guess first.
I agree, most likely AZOV in a stolen Russian Sub.
Maybe the Russians will BLOW the LNG ships from the U.S… That would be a balanced quid pro quo….. Yes…????
Russia is trying hard to not escalate to World War III. That would do it.
Biden promised to destroy Nord Stream. When they asked him: how? He said: we have the means to destroy it.
We may be obsolete but we have a jiggle in our wiggle and were groovin when we’re movin’….
He said it in Feb. 2022, long before Russia acted in Ukraine.
Yes, exactly. Biden promised to destroy Nord Stream in case of Russian intervention in Ukraine. So he has done what he promised.
This unholy war is being nurtured and financed by UNHOLY American interests who are only interested in making money. The BILLIONS of dollars going to Arms Manufacturers could have been used to rebuild Ukraine if America and the UK ha not interfered in the peace deal that Ukraine and Russia had already agreed on in APRIL 2022.
Biden is so smug now wait till his actions return to bite him in the ass.He only does what his brainless advises tell him to do. He PROMISED this action and now that it has been carried out, he alone is to blame for Europe having to go through a COLD winter. Blaming Russia for damaging the pipeline which they built and which belongs to Russia is so STUPID – even war mad Americans will not believe such rubbish.
“he alone is to blame for Europe having to go through a cold winter” – why France and Germany should follow Americans so blindly? How it is possible that French and German top politicians who signed Minsk Agreements and sabotaged them during 7 years, are innocent? We remember the panic in European political class after Trump became president. Most European politicians were absolutely frustrated. Biden is doing what many European politicians want him to do. Zaporozhie nuclear power station is attacked quite regular and not only by American Himars, but also by French artillery too. No one in EU is trying to stop it. If German government would decide to launch Nord Stream 2, it could be launched a year ago.
France and Germany follow the US blindly because they are all in the cartel of Arms Dealers making a PROFIT from this war.
War Profiteering?! Of course.
Germany has been a US vassal state since capitulation in 1945. What would it take to get out from under Uncle Sam’s boot? WWIII?
Why near Denmark?
Cheap airline tickets? Pipeline is close to shore so you and your buddy can rent a cheap skiff and motor on out their Scuba down to the pipe and leave your explosives. Remember to come back with some fresh caught fish.
If the pipeline is in such shallow water for scuba it will be back on line in notime.
Wouldn’t you rather have a pizza?…Oh and some cold beer (imported of course and Chicago doesn’t count) in the cooler.
Danish beer is very nice.
i guess that is one way to hurt russia financially.
and a way to hurt eastern europe physically.
two birds with one stone, right uncle sam?
The eu and companies inside there are toast. Then China and friends of Russia will now have all the gas the need including Hungry & Austria. Amerika defeats the eu again.
US sabotage… The schoolyard bully of the world strikes again.
This may have a significant negative effect on European and particularly German public opinion of the US. The prevailing assumption is probably that the US did it, and who wants an uncontrollable “ally” that literally attacks you? How would Americans feel if the British started secretly blowing up US pipelines? It seems like a really dumb thing for the US to do, which just makes it more likely.
Totally logical TC!
Yes, “American journalist”. Anne Applebaum is a neocon. She is a member of the Council on Foreign Relations, and the CIA organ “National Endowment of Democracies,” called the “second CIA”. The NED founder Alan Weinstein said that they took over tasks that the CIA used to do.
So it goes.
The neocons may have crossed a red line which is even too much for a polish nationalist. We can be sure he hates Russians like Brzezinski did.
If it walks like a neocon, talks like a neocon it must be a neocon… Plus, there is a definitive odor, amongst neocons… It smells like spoiled fish….
A bit over qualified, don’t you think?….
Actually, the gas pipeline is jointly owned by Gazprom and a number of German, Dutch, French, etc., companies. It’s interesting that Poland wants to destroy the economy of its EU partners while receiving billions of subsidies from these same EU countries.
Occam’s Razor………….
Well, well, well … We’re surely living in those interesting times now, eh? If this is truly some idiotic western move, I don’t foresee a long lifespan and happy operations for the Norwegian gas line or any other line bringing alternate supplies to Europe. I also do foresee lots of critical infrastructure in the ME and North America suddenly developing unusual maint issues soon.
Nobody ever beats the Russians at exacting revenge when wronged …
Whatever gasoline that moved in to replace Nord will also be targeted. Europe’s best hope is for climate change to provide a sunny and warm winter,
The Russians are winning because they don’t do what the West expects, they do what the West does not expect. If the West can provoke the Russians into a revenge attack on Western pipelines, that would play into the West’s hands. The one who blinks first loses.
You think they can’t do these things with plausible deniability … like use some terrorist cutouts or something?
If the west has already started pipeline blowups, there’s no going back.
The US has tried to disrupt Russian/Soviet gas/oil supplies for at least 60 years by a combination of sanctions and sabotage. In 1962 they halted West German pipe exports to the Soviet Union by sanctions. In 1982, the CIA blew up a gas pumping station in Siberia in what is known as the biggest non-nuclear blast of all times. That was only revealed a few years ago when secrete documents were released.
Either the US used subcontractors or mercenaries that can’t be traced back to a government agency, or British, Polish or Ukrainian secrete services did it with or without tacit approval from Washington.
If they blame it on Russia, they could use it as a casus belli for WWIII.
While it’s easy to blame Russia for the sabotage for some grand chess move, the idea was that once the pipeline is shutoff, they won’t be able to turn it back on until the leaks are repaired. As far as blaming U.S., the pesky British may easily be involved in to put the blame on another country. It was always in the best interest of the British to keep US/Russia apart.
Perhaps the best bet is that British, Polish and Ukrainian secrete services cooked up some plan to destroy the German economy.
It won’t save the British economy, which is going south with the British pound hitting new lows against the dollar, but it’ll drag down Germany too.
Early assumptions were Poland. Russia back in April reported Poles were doing flyovers while they were working on the pipeline (reported in Tass). Now that some Poles are blaming the US, I suspect it was indeed them.
Somebody should point out that attacking a Russian pipeline is a direct act of war against Russia.
Russia will survive, Germany may not.
So when will we see sabotage of “the Baltic Pipe, another natural gas pipeline that will carry gas from Norway through Denmark to Poland?”
That would be by Russia.
That would leave the EU in deep trouble, with supplies only for winter, and that enough only if these other sources keep flowing.
As I watch Brandon proclaim back in FEB that he would end the flow of Russian gas….lol….if the Baltic Pipe were to suffer a similar fate, who then steps in to “save’ the EU from a very cold winter with their overpriced NG and stands to make BILLION$ as the EU is once again forced to “rely” on neocons as their saviors.
Seems to me that the new British PM is a Hawk and likely needed to impress the other western leaders with this bold new policy.
It sure makes Germany;s future industrial growth a thing of the past.
Bombs beat sanctions I guess.
Another article today reports that a majority of Americans want a quick diplomatic end to this war.
This attack makes such a diplomatic resolution even more difficult. It is now impossible, in practice. It likely was impossible even before the pipeline was removed from any possible early deal.
Just in case the Europeans get cold feet and do something really stupid
like suggesting a ceasefire in Ukraine, turning on the gas and having a real discussion about resolving the conflict.
Those gutlass Europeans needed to be saved from themselves.
There done and done !
Here in the USA we the people are also gutless. We allow queer minds to rule us.
I suspect USA or UK.
Russia attacking something in in “Western” territorial waters oand areas of Western economic influence would constitute a direct attack on those nations. A dangerous and foolish escalation.
Plus there is no need when Russia controls the source and
really wants to sell gas now or eventually.
Similarly, USA/UK attacking in Russian waters would constitute a direct attack on Russian infrastructure. Also dangerous and foolish.
The logical conclusion is that the big opponents of the pipelines are guilty and they conducted sabotage in “friendly” territory.
“Russia attacking something in in ‘Western’ territorial waters oand areas of Western economic influence would constitute a direct attack on those nations. A dangerous and foolish escalation.”
Danger and foolishness haven’t been a deterrent to escalation for the Russian regime yet. Why would they suddenly start being deterrents now?
Are YOU actually proposing the Russians attacked their OWN PIPELINE… Did you neglect to watch the video of Biden saying he could stop the pipeline, and the screwey SMIRK.. Does he really thinkn this confrontation is funny, like the end of the life? What about the U.S. attacking thhe pipeline. Yes,,, “A dangerous and foolish escalation.” but byWHOME…?????
If I was forced to place a bet on who attacked the pipeline, I’d put my money on the US.
But there are plausible reasons for the Russians to attack their own pipeline.
I don’t know who attacked it. You probably don’t either. The difference between us is that I don’t pretend to know things I don’t actually know.
You are throwing mud against the logic wall. none of it sticks… Lets wait and see, but that Biden video confession is a lot more convinng, than these unlikely scenarios you keep dreaming up…
Just give a single plausible Reason for Russia to destroy its own pipeline.
The Russians have a switch that allows them to turn the gas on and off at will. Why would they give away that leverage and the potential to earn some revenues on their investment in the future?
Only the US, UK, Ukraine have reasons to destroy the pipeline in order to sink the German economy. German factories are already relocating to the US because energy in Germany costs 8 times of what it costs in the US.
The US has tried to disrupt Russian pipelines since 1962 when it first stopped German pipe exports to the Soviet Union by sanctions. In the summer of 1984, the CIA blew up a gas pumping station in Siberia with a Trojan horse software in what is known as the most powerful non-nuclear explosions of all times.
– The US has sabotaged Russian pipelines in the past
– Only a few months ago, Biden said he will stop NS2 and that the US has the means to do so.
– The US benefits by selling its LNG to Europe at a premium
– The US benefits by German industry moving to the US
– The US has the means to destroy the pipeline
– US warships were seen in the region shortly before the blast
But yeah, but let’s assume it was Santa Claus or Putin …
Agreed. I find the notion that Russia would destroy the pipeline in order to what? to coerce the Germans to call for an end to sanctions so they could go back to buying cheaper gas from Russia….
Based on what little I’ve read about the Poles and their behavior toward just about everybody in the neighborhood, I’d be more inclined toward Washington subcontracting the job out to someone local.
You are probably right. They didn’t do it themselves. They use subcontractors of subcontractors of subcontractors of … until they get credible deniability.
Just give a single plausible Reason for Russia to destroy its own pipeline.
The Russians have a switch that allows them to turn the gas on and off at will. Why would they give away that leverage and the potential to earn some revenues on their investment in the future?
Only the US, UK, Ukraine have reasons to destroy the pipeline in order to sink the German economy. German factories are already relocating to the US because energy in Germany costs 8 times of what it costs in the US.
The US has tried to disrupt Russian pipelines since 1962 when it first stopped German pipe exports to the Soviet Union by sanctions. In the summer of 1984, the CIA blew up a gas pumping station in Siberia with a Trojan horse software in what is known as the most powerful non-nuclear explosions of all times.
– The US has sabotaged Russian pipelines in the past
– Only a few months ago, Biden said he will stop NS2 and that the US has the means to do so.
– The US benefits by selling its LNG to Europe at a premium
– The US benefits by German industry moving to the US
– The US has the means to destroy the pipeline
– US warships were seen in the region shortly before the blast
But yeah, but let’s assume it was Santa Claus or Putin …
“Some circumstantial evidence is very strong, as when you find a trout in the milk.” Henry David Thoreau
(Referring to a court case asserting that milk had been watered down.)
Why are the Russians conscripting troops that they can’t provide with sleeping bags and medical supplies? Not a lot that this regime is doing makes sense.
And the most obvious reason Russia would do it, in my mind, is to panic the EU into ending any support for Ukraine.
Yo, Lemony. I can’t fault you for getting misled by “news” from Western propaganda. For help with reality, check out the YouTube video I provided for Kenneth Harper above.
I tried to google the guys in the video and I still have no idea who they are or why they’re credible.
Just a thought. If it is the USA who is responsible and Navy Seals and a submarine were used for the mission surely in time submarine crew members will spill their mouths and the truth will come out. Or maybe a submarine was not used and instead the CIA or some other similar ilk used small craft crewed by scoundrel mercenaries and the missions were launched from nearby land locations?
This cannot be viewed as merely an attack against Russia. It is an attack against Eurasia and any hopes for peace and prosperity they may have not to mention any hope for autonomy from the Atlantic Colossus which has shattered far more lives than any other single nation. All of Russia’s crimes, however immoral they may have been, are responses to the intervention of this imperial entity. If there was ever any doubt to where the allegiances of NATO stand, there should be no longer. NATO stands against the prosperity and independence of Europe. NATO stands against the survival of the poor so long as that survival is not dependent on their authoritarian whims. This is class terrorism.
The Poles always saw EU solidarity as a one way street, but it’s never been as obvious as it is now. While they keep on receiving billions in EU subsidies, mostly payed by Germany, they want to destroy the German economy just for the fun of it.
Psychopaths will be psychopaths.
Sikorsky was in Kyiv to heat up the Maidan protests in 2014 for the coup that led to the Ukraine war.
By accepting the Poles and the Baltic countries as new members, the EU swallowed a poison pill that will kill the EU.
The people who cooked up this proxy war are galactically incompetent and dangerous.
You have GOTTA LOVIT!!!!! Victoria Nuland “Strategic ambigity on the sabatage to the pipeline. This is a very good pathway to WWIII!!!!!!!!!! What do they think will be Putins answer to this provocation??? Or did they neglect to anticipate the probable consequences of this EXITENTIAL PROVOCATION? This woman is dead set on a WWIII scenario just at the time the U.S. is a generation behind in cutting edge military technology due to the squandered time and treasure spent chasing NOMADS on the Great War on Terror. This woman is a danger to all life on EARTH…
Can I mention, just in passing, of course 😉 the term “drawn and quartered”?
Aye, there’s the rub!
The US has nothing to fear since Germany doesn’t have nuclear weapons. This effectively kills Germany’s energy life-line for good. To Russia it’s just a minor nuisance.
It is clear, the US is the real enemy, the USA weaponized energy, not Russia, not Putin, no, it was American administrations.
It started way back in 1953 in Iran and has continued to this day. We only need to open our eyes and look at the ME and Venezuela, it is all about oil, we will kill children by starving them to death to get the regime change we want. Now they worked their way up and finally can go for Regime Change and destruction of Russia. It is not Putin, no, the evil starts in Washington, the monsters in D.C. are driven by greed and they would kill their mothers and children for more oil and money and power, avarice and hate are motivating them.
Renate, you’re being a bit hard on us, don’t ya think?…. When Neoconism gets on your shoes, it’s almost impossible to clean off…
Donna, I don’t think so, I am a realist. Wars are about markets and resources. Donna, with Americans I always mean the administration, the ruling elite, not the people. The middleclass and I am one of them, will be used to pay the bill. The wealthy are not about to pay even a fair share of taxes. Biden said, Putin must go, he would like a Navalny like head of state and a divided Russia and control over Russian resources by privatizing the nations resources and put American corporations in charge. That is what this war is about. Putin was elected by a big majority and he has high approval ratings. He is the president of the Russian people and accountable to them. He is a proud Russian and wants the best for his country and people, and why not? for doing his job for the Russian people our MSM demonizes him. Secure borders is important to a nation which has been invaded many times, and why is that not acceptable to US/NATO?
Why did the US invade Iraq? Was it a legal war, killing hundreds of thousand Iraqis and putting the country in ruins, some thousand years of civilization destroyed. Iraq was no danger to us, but Reagan supported Saddam to fight a bloody 8 year war against Iran, why did the Reagan people do that? Bush Sr. continued with the Gulf war and so did Clinton. Our government is on the side of the neocons, without any dissent worth mentioning. The USA attacks oil rich nations, like Libya, Iran, Iraq and Russia and Venzuela. When was the last time the US has been attacked?
Zelensky throws Ukraine and the people under the bus for the money Americans pay him. That is his service to his country. Our MSM glorifies the traitor for that.
If he were our president he would be executed for that.
Without Putin, Russia would no longer exist today. After Gorbachev handed the key to the Russian economy to the neolibs, the Americans succeeded in destroying the Russian economy under Yeltsin. They even boasted about having bought Yeltsin’s election. Then they went on to attack Russian allies including Serbia, Iraq etc. It’s amazing that Putin managed to rebuild the country both economically and militarily in only 20 years to be able to stand against the collective West, which is 20 times more powerful than Russia.
It’s telling that the West supports a Nazi-sympathizer and hardline Islamophobe like Navalny. With Navalny at the Kremlin, the Russian Federation (which includes 20 million Muslims), would descend into civil war and dismemberment. It’s too cynical to contemplate, but it’s exactly what US imperialism does.
I do believe the irrational sabotage on the two pipelines will come back to hound the USA. By this time no European with a brain could honestly believe that anyone but the USA did that. Biden has made enemies all over the globe even gullible Europeans will wake up this time. They underestimated Russia big time and overestimated themselves, they are not invincible. I think that NATO will bail out and Russia and China would make it a two front war for the USA. The only allies they have are coerced allies, they now know who their so-called Ally is, the mask came down. Other than the UK, what nation would trust the Americans?
Germany is still an occupied country. It has no sovereignty. Secrete clauses to the 2+4 agreement for German reunification make sure that the US can do what it wants in Germany. And the Germans can’t complain.
Germany is now physically cut off from Russian gas. If Germany now accuses the US of sabotage, the Americans will cut off LNG supplies to Germany too.
The Russians have been a reliable supplier for over 50 years without ever using the gas for political blackmail. The US doesn’t do anything but political blackmail. The US acts like a protection Mafia.
The Germans can think what they want, they are effectively hostages of US policy.
I was against German reunification. History has proven me right.
Any brains left in Europe?… No? … Yes! There is evidence that at least one European can think on his own: “Radek Sikorski, a former Polish foreign minister and current Member of European Parliament, suggested on Twitter that Washington was behind the attack.” I was proven wrong and I’m glad for that… But wait, he’s a neocon and is married to a neocon? Nevermind.
It’s rather like inbreeding, neoconism…
What I find interesting is the opportunity this provides for Russia to “propagandize” to the European voting population — and in particular to the Germans — who their real enemy is.
This act of violent destruction was ***NOT*** aimed at Russia. It was ***blatantly and overtly*** aimed at Germany. This is the Germans under attack. The Germans are having their economy/standard of living/prosperity/way of life destroyed … by their own leadership, by Scholz et al, in thrall to the US Neocons.
Until now, all of that could have been reversed in an instant by turning on Nordstreams 1 & 2. The US knew that, saw it as a threat to US/Neocon hegemony, and foreclosed that possibility, and sealing Germany’s fate (or so they think). The US contemptuously and brazenly arrogated to itself the right to destroy Germany.
Consequences?
I can see a revolt by the German people, a precipitous exit from the EU and NATO, a speedy reconciliation with Russia, reenergizing their economy, and a “warp speed” effort to repair the two pipelines before winter, or at least before their current store of gas runs out.
We shall see.
Interesting times.
We can always dream, but the fact is that Germany is steadfastly refusing to see the elephant in the room while most of the world is convinced that the US sabotaged the pipelines. The Ukrainians would probably be eager to do it, but I doubt they have the means.
The capacity of Germans for self-denial is unlimited. I guess they have no choice as long as they hold onto their security arrangement with the US.
The leaks are so massive that the pipes must be full of seawater by now. That means they are probably beyond repair. That seals Germany’s economic future. The government can hand out money to the people to compensate for increased energy bills for a while; however, if Germany is de-industrialized by industries moving abroad, Germany may never recover.
If Germany were a sovereign state, this attack on its economic life-line would be seen as a casus belli.
You make a great case for it being a Russian false flag attack.
But I’m not sure that’s the case you intended to make.
With all due respect, I do not believe the German government has what is required to stand up to the hegemon.
You’re probably right.
But governments can fall. And they’ve fallen in Germany several times — the monarchy at the end of WWI, the Weimar Republic in 1933, the Third Reich in 1945, and the collapse of the GDR in 1990. And “Germany” has only existed as a unitary state for 150 years. That’s a collapse/change of regime on average of every 40 years … and it’s been more than 30 since the last one.
Following the asymmetric shock of the pandemic, the economic war against Russia will create poverty and lead to social unrest in Europe. As in the Weimar Republic, that will lead to fascism. It’s not by coincidence that Francis Fukuyama now sings in praise of the deep state. Big capital has brought the Nazis to power, just like the Oligarchs brought the Bandera Nazis to power in Ukraine. Next will be the whole of Europe descending into some sort of fascist dictatorship led by the deep state.
The way disinformation and censorship has kicked in all over Europe, it feels like we had a fascist coup in February and nobody dares to speak about it. People are banned from social media, people’s financial existence is destroyed, anybody with a dissident view is defamed as a Putin troll. Even in private, I can no longer say what I think. In the 71 years of my life, I have never experienced anything of the kind.
The Americans have always resented that Germans have better healthcare, better welfare, more holidays, better cars, fewer crimes, longer life expectancy, etc., than Americans. I guess many Americans will be gleeful that all of that is being destroyed (Schadenfreude). America cannot improve the livelihood of its own people, so it has to drag other people down.
Without evidence/investigation, it’s hard to guess but like everyone else here, I will rush to conclusion like in the case of Alexander Dugin and suggest that:
1. It was an attack conducted by the Super Dangerous Neo Nazis from the AZOV Battalion. Perhaps, they now have their own Nuclear Subs.
2. There is an interesting matter surrounding this attack. There is another Baltic Pipeline that runs Gas from Denmark to Poland underwater as well and perpendicular to the Nord Stream, It is located very close to where the explosion took place. Perhaps the Russians hit the wrong one.
3. Maybe a disgruntled non state actor/group with the capabilities from either side.
4. A Russian Combat Diver in a mini sub who decided to smoke or deserters trying to flee Russia through that pipeline to avoid mobilization.
“Explosions Cause Major Damage to Both Nord Stream Pipelines A Polish member of European Parliament suggested the US was responsible”
This makes any submarine in the Baltic fair game!
Pepe Escobar’s take…
Germany and EU have been handed over a declaration of war
https://www.presstv.ir/Detail/2022/09/28/690009/Germany-EU-have-been-handed-over-declaration-of-war
That’s not correct. The explosion occurred near the island of Bornholm where the pipes are at a depths of > 70 meters.
https://ens.dk/en/press/permit-nord-stream-2-project-granted-danish-energy-agency
I haven’t heard a definitive opinion on this, but I think the pipeline is now beyond repair. In view of the huge amount of gas that’s been emitted, large sections of the pipe must be now full of seawater, which is very corrosive.
There are now 4 leaks in total, 2 in NS1 and 2 in NS2. Whoever did this, was trying to make sure that the pipeline will be put out of operation.
There is now no hope for the German economy.
Yes, I’ve seen opinions about how much damage could have been done, in terms of salt water, sand, etc. I’ll leave it to Gazprom to make the final determination.
I don’t think a sub was used, either. Some sort of submersible robot could have been used. I read somewhere that such a device was actually found near a pipeline in another incident, I forget where, with English markings. Either way, it had to be a fairly sophisticated operation. I doubt Ukraine had the capability or access to the region. Russia, too, would be operating in somewhat hostile waters, as the countries around it would be looking for Russian subs or other ships, whereas the US had a significant presence right in the vicinity. As Mercouris points out in his video yesterday, the US had “means, motive and opportunity”, whereas the other suspects lac at least one of those.
You’re absolutely correct that Germany and much of the rest of the EU is hosed. well, as Martyanov says, they brought it on themselves.
You mean like the rape victim brought it onto herself?
Many commenters: “It’s about oil.”
This is not quite right. It’s about the unit of accounting by which oil is traded.
A tiny oligarchy enjoys the privilege of creating money out of nothing. They enjoy this privilege only to the degree they can force others to use that money as money. The invasion of Iraq was not about “weapons of mass destruction.” It was not an honest mistake made by tragically misinformed but otherwise benevolent public servants. It was about the fact that Iraq had started selling their oil for something other than dollars. The first thing invading U.S. troops did was take over the Ministry of Oil and switch back to dollars. Never mind the deaths of U.S. troops or Iraqi civilians. Mission accomplished. It wasn’t incompetence. It was an agenda hidden from the plebeian.
Saudi Arabia is a country where you can be beheaded for being openly homosexual or Christian. Yet they are an unquestioned ally. Why? Because they sell their oil exclusively for dollars. No need to export democracy there.
With the impending completion of Nordstream 2, peace was about to break out between Germany and Russia. They would eventually have no use for SWIFT (Society for Worldwide Interbank Financial Telecommunications) and thus no use for the dollar. There were oligarchic forces in the West who were not going to allow that to happen. Thus the Ukraine proxy war with Russia, and the sabotage of the Nordstream pipelines (and the wars against Iran, Syria, Libya, etc.). If you won’t sell your oil for dollars, you won’t be allowed to sell it at all.
It’s not about oil, because Nord stream doesn’t carry oil.
Why would Russia destroy a pipeline they more or less control. They can cut off or reduce the gas supply at any time as they see fit. Ukraine has the most interest, but not the means. The MICIMATT complex has a strong interest in severing Europe from Russia – and punish Russia at the same time.
Something else. How come we’re not hearing anything from the UN Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change and other Climate Change /Global Warming Organizations on the grave consequences that our planet will suffer from the sabatoge of the Nord Stream Pipelines?