Hamas has submitted to Egyptian and Qatari mediators its formal response to a Gaza ceasefire proposal that was recently outlined by President Biden. The Palestinian group is seeking stronger assurances on a permanent ceasefire and Israeli withdrawal from Gaza.
Under the initial proposal, the two sides would negotiate a permanent truce during the first phase and implement it in the second phase.
An official familiar with the talks told The Washington Post that Hamas’s response contained “amendments to the Israeli proposal, including a timeline for a permanent ceasefire and the complete withdrawal of Israeli troops from the Gaza Strip.”
Hamas and Palestinian Islamic Jihad said in the joint statement that the response “prioritizes the interests of the Palestinian people and emphasizes the need for a complete halt to the ongoing aggression in Gaza.”
When President Biden outlined the ceasefire proposal on May 31, he said it would bring about a permanent end to Israel’s military operations in Gaza. But Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu quickly rejected the idea of a permanent ceasefire and has repeatedly said the onslaught won’t end until Israel achieves its goals, which includes the destruction of Hamas.
Israeli officials previously told Axios that the language in the ceasefire proposal was vague enough for Israel and Hamas to enter the first phase of the deal, which involves a six-week truce and initial hostage and prisoner exchange, without Israel committing to a permanent ceasefire. But they said Netanyahu’s comments would likely sabotage the chances of an agreement since it would make Hamas seek stronger guarantees, which they have done.
Israeli officials are now accusing Hamas of rejecting the ceasefire proposal by asking for more assurances. “This evening, Israel received, via the mediator, the Hamas response. In its response, Hamas has rejected the proposal for a hostage release that was presented by President Biden,” an Israeli official told Reuters. “They have changed all of the main and most meaningful parameters.”
Hamas’s response came a day after the UN Security Council passed a resolution calling for a ceasefire in Gaza based on the proposal outlined by Biden. In response to the resolution, Hamas said it was ready to “enter into indirect negotiations on the implementation of these principles.”
Netanyahu‘s Office also responded:
….“The claim that Israel agreed to end the war before achieving all its goals is a total lie,” says the PMO….
The full document, argues Netanyahu’s office, would show that “Israel will not end the war until all its conditions are met — that is, fighting until Hamas is eliminated, returning all of our hostages, and ensuring that Gaza never again represents a threat to Israel.” (Times of Israel…..
This exact words were spoken by the Israeli representative in UN immediatelly after the redolution passed. Russia abstained, and explained its abstention by the vagueness of tge resolution and by the unclear stance of Israel. In fact, Russian rep asked Israel, thatvwas present there during the viote, to confirm.
And to everyine’s shock , Israel essentially rejected the resolutiin by assuring everyone that its plan has not changed — continue operation until total victory. Israel also said that the presence of hostages in Palestinian homes proves that Palestinians are not innocent and thus no regrets at killing so many in rescue operation.
The fact that hostages are allowed to walk outside to get sun snd fresh air, to Israel it is proof of collective guilt. But Palestinian hostages are kept in inhumane cinditions, tortured and killed, cannot even be mentioned.
Biden is a catastrophy walking. Why did he get personally involved in advancing “Israeli” peace proposal, knowing full well that Israel will trash him so mercilessly as the eyes of the world were on that UN SC meeting?
I've never believed in the "reality" of the Biden presidency. He was a convenience to prevent Sanders, and presently to hang the disasters in the Ukraine and Israel on when he loses in Nov.. At which point a thoroughly tamed Trump, and a 'clean' regime would be convenient. And believe it or not there are some intelligent NeoConZionazis who can see that BB, Ita, and Bezalel are destroying Israel. These 'enlightened' nazis are trying to find a way thru the mess. And this all could be an attempt at putting their neanderthal bro's in an impossible bind to twist in the wind and leave them to their fate. In short, I am inclined to think it all a multi-variable equation, … much more byzantine and weighty than US electoral politics.
A propos, listen to the interview with Shir Hever on EI.
Thanks, very granular analysis of the internal psychosis and socio-political dead-end.
Well, the president doesn't need your "belief". Yes, he was the pro-corporate candidate against Sanders. No reason to assume he will lose, and Trump is tamed? Quite the opposite. Zionnazis? What an absurd phrase. So, they simultaneously believe in their superiority and inferiority?
People in Israel believe in punishing terrorists who murder their people. They don't care what you "believe".
"And to everyone's shock". Good one. Mr. Bidette is only looking forward to the Palestinians being finished off (just as Mr. Drumps opined) before the election. Boy, I wish I could be at the Democratic Convention in August. It has been circulated that Mr. Bidette will attend via Zoom. That way AI can touch up his speech patterns, physical mannerisms.
"Why did [Biden] get personally involved in advancing 'Israeli' peace proposal, knowing full well that Israel will trash him"?
Why the latest bait n' bomb 'peace proposal'? November.
Yes. I think Biden desparately needs to get Gaza out of the news and off the agenda before the election. Not one, but two ongoing wars, neither going well from Biden's viewpoint, and one of which, at the least, in which the USA is clearly on the side of the aggressors, who also happen to be committing war crimes on a wholesale scale, is not the FP record that Biden wants to run on.
Biden and his handlers belong in the Hague.
Ukraine is not the aggressor. That is why every country in the world (except 5) voted against the Russian invasion; it is not Ukraine that is brutalizing Russian villages and kidnaping their children.
UN Resolution ES‑11/1 opposed Russia's invasion of Ukraine and demanded a full withdrawal of Russian forces.
The countries that agree with you:
Russia, Belarus, Eritrea, North Korea, Russia, Syria. Fine company.
wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Nations_General_Assembly_Resolution_ES-11/1#:~:text=The%20resolution%20was%20sponsored%20by,5%20against%2C%20and%2035%20abstentions.
Downvoted and blocked. Goodbye.
two ongoing wars
He wasn't talking about Ukraine.
OK. so, there is a war in Gaza. What is the other war? Yemen? Myanmar? Sudan? Syria? The conflict in Khyber Pakhtunkhwa? Gang wars in Haiti? The Naxalite-Maoist insurgency?
In which we have our dirty hands in, directly or indirectly.
Well, he are helping the Saudis in Yemen, and we are still in Syria and Somalia. It's not the Texas Comanche wars.
He could have prevented the deaths and wounding of untold thousands in Gaza, just like he could have prevented the debacle in Ukraine. There is something else running our "ship of state", and it ain't him.
August.
The resolution IS very vague, just as the Russian representative at the SC claimed. It references Biden's May 31 "proposal" for a ceasefire, but nowhere, that I can find, is that proposal actually presented, verbatim, as a text. Rather, I can find nothing but summaries of the ceasefire plan, such as is presented in the resolution itself. It is all well and good for the SC to "welcome" Biden's plan (which is all it did). But it would be nice to see exactly what that plan entails.
Also, again, as the Russian ambassador stated, the Israeli position IS unclear. At best. The resolution says that Israel "has accepted" the proposal, but there are contradictory, to say the least, statements coming from Israeli officials. And, to repeat, it is kind of disinegenous to say that Israel "has accepted" the plan, when we don't have the actual wording of the plan. What, exactly, has Israel "accepted?"
Hamas, apparently, has given an "official response" to the proposed plan, accepting most of it, but offering some amendments. Has Israel made an "official response?" Israel is now saying that Hamas has "rejected" the plan, which seems to be inaccurate, at best, and an outright lie, at worst.
Biden’s approval numbers at an all time low.
His name is "BIDETTE"…………….
The usual modus operandi. Israel/U.S. proposed and agreement they say solves everything, but throws stuff in it that they know will not fly. So, there is no agreement.
Biden put this out because it makes him look to the US public for his election campaign. No other reason. He might have also thought it would pressure Netanyahu to agree – which is ridiculous and shows the level of incompetence of his advisors. Everyone knows Netanyahu will never agree – except apparently the stupid US public.
Yes, basically the same as the US view of Al-Qaeda in Afghanistan.
Which became ISIS, which was a convenient proxy to assail Syria.
Here you go again with your 'everybody does it, so what?' routine. Personally I denounce Wash. and Tel Aviv foreign policy united to further monger wars for the sake of the few oligarchs ruling both nations behind the scenes. Avarice is one of the 7 deadly sins, and lots of death going on now due to the policies of the swine in both nations.
Well, that's fair. Yes, US and Israeli policy support US geopolitical power, and many feel that supporting the US ruling class does not help their self-interest.
I find several flaws in that type of thinking:
1. As in the 1920s-1930s, the left opposed the US ruling class, which they felt exploited the working class for great profit. Some advocated the Soviet model of communism, where the working class ruled and profits did not go to a parasitic ruling class.
However, by the 1940s, the view changes as they realized that the US/UK capitalist system was somewhat benign compared with the brutal alternatives – German fascism and Russian Stalinism. Neither offered self-government, individual rights, or protection from government abuse.
2. In our current situation, many Americans enjoy the benefits of American power without supporting the means to that power. So, the question is, what would a powerless US society look like? If the US is not a world power, then some changes would occur quickly. Russia and China would become dominant in the world, and US access to energy would be severely limited. A US paying $10-$15/gallon for gas would quickly have massive unemployment, a collapsed housing market, and an crashed stock market. Unemployment would surge above Great Depression levels (25%+) and we would have massive social upheaval, food shortages, and civil unrest, requiring a massive government response.
So, while it's fine to complain about the "ruling class" or whatever, the question is, what's the alternative? It would presumably mean a Russia that dominates Europe and the Middle East, and a China that dominates Asia. Russia would control world energy and China would control world technology and industry. If you don't mind paying $10/gallon for Russian gas and working for a Chinese company with no benefits and 6-day work-weeks, then I guess you'll be happy.
All that must mean you have a hot line to the future, or did some god tell you that. Things NEVER happen as speculated. The library book sales have dozens of doom saying books on US economics dating from the early ’70s until now, like: “The Coming Collapse”, etc. I’m sure you know about those sensational books and events that never happened.
It doesn't take some gift of prophecy to say that the U.S. is better of with the world's most advance tank, jet, and missile technology from Israel; even Israel's critics don't dispute this. There is also the ability to operate out of the Middle East (an area vital to U.S. interests), and intelligence gathering by Israel is famous for its value; Israel even warned the U.S. about the risk of an attack right before 9/11 (although it was ignored).
And those libraries you mention are full of stories of collapsed powers, going back to Roman times. You'll notice that Putin – a student of history – is restoring allies around the world – including China, Cuba, North Korea, Syria, and Vietnam. Russia doesn't care about ethical issues – it slaughters civilians in its own country – in Chechnya – and in Syria and Ukraine. It doesn't care about abuses in Cuba, North Korea, and Syria (600,000 civilians dead).
And look at your country – the US -which killed more than 200,000 civilians – on purpose – in WWII, and probably 1 million more in the "War on Terror". So, maybe you should focus on your own country before advising others. (You won't).
Fascinating Antiwar(dot)com article from 2018 on the Likudnik Lobby in the U.S.
https://original.antiwar.com/smith-grant/2018/08/29/treasury-sanctions-foreigners-for-israel/
Here's an update: israelpalestinenews dot org/why-aipac-is-still-israels-foreign-agent/
AIPAC was/is the subsidiary of the American Zionist Council that was forced by JFK and RFK (senior) to register as a foreign agent. For various reasons, the AZC dissolved. AIPAC remained. If it was a subsidiary of the AZC, then it is a foreign agent. It should not be allowed to interfere with the politics of the U.S. Period.
Thank you. Gee, wonder why this information was not posted by the media.
Strategically, it would be wise for Hamas to "accept" the plan under the following "clarifications:" that the massacre (not war) will end, that all residents can return, that Israel leaves the territory, and that the facilities are rebuilt … etc.
This way, they are saying yes, and clarifying what yes means.
I think they already have.
Israel and Hamas have unreconcilable differences. Israel wants everyone in Hamas dead or gone; Hamas wants to stay in control of Gaza. There really is no middle ground.
Perhaps things will quiet down for a few months until after the US election; whomever is president, Israel will be free to complete the eradication of Hamas, and will have time to figure out what to do with Gaza once Hamas is gone.
It is Israel that is "gone" … as in any semblance to a democratic modern state. What is left is what any occupying theocratic ethno-state with eventually become: a moral vacuum not long for the world.
Hamas will not be needed once the one-state solution creates equal governance for all citizens of historic Palestine.
Honest opinion is limited and may not be printed. It requires approval.
HAMAS dared to break out of the open air concentration camp Gaza is for them and their parents and siblings, that is their crime. They dared fighting savage Israelis, they have nothing to lose but a miserable life. In their minds they will sooner die than live a life of torture and humiliation under a savage occupier.
That is not an accurate description.
1. Gaza is not a "concentration camp". Israel left Gaza in 2005 and Gaza was free to develop, as long as they refrained from killing Israelis. In fact, they received billions of dollars in aid and could have been a prosperous area – with beaches, farms, resorts, etc. But Hamas diverted their aid to guns, rockets, missiles, RPGs, IEDs, ammunition, tunnels, command centers, computers, etc.
2. No, killing Israeli men, women, children, and babies is not justified under any circumstances; that is a crime that you seem to be justifying, saying that breaking out "was their only crime". So, mass murder, kidnapping, mutilation, and sexual abuse are not crimes, as long as it's Israeli women and children?
3. The Israelis are not "savage". Like any nation, if you don't kill them, they leave you alone. Israel has peace treaties with countries like Jordan and Egypt – because they don't try to kill their people.
Many of the Israeli families – that you call "savages" – who were butchered and burned on Oct 7 desired peace with Gazans and actually helped them, with medical care and other forms of support. They can't help them now, of course, because they were reduced to smoldering corpses.
4. You call Israel an occupier but this is false – it is actually Hamas that illegally occupies Gaza, which they took in a violent coup after disputed elections. They have no international legitimacy and rule Gaza as a dictatorship, without freedom or elections, and with extrajudicial executions.
5. All that Gazans need to do is the same as those in Jordan and Egypt and other peaceful areas – simply refrain from killing Israelis. If they would do that, then there would be no reason for conflict, and Gaza would prosper. But that is not the choice they have made.
Yes, it would be ideal if everyone in the Middle East could live a peaceful coexistence.
“There is so much hate between Arabs and Jews, they cannot possibly live in one state.”
If you want to continue commenting here, you’re going to have to knock off the anti-Jewish and anti-Arab racism.
That's not what my comment says.
Surely, you know that Hamas came to power through a fair and balanced election (President Carter was there and deemed the election fair and balanced). Hamas' political arm got involved in the election at the insistence of the US. With the win, came swift action by Israel and the U.S.. Hamas officials were arrested. The brutal blockade that has lasted since was imposed. The Palestinians citizens were punished for their terrible act of voting for the party they wanted to represent them. The "democracies" of Israel and the U.S. quashed democracy in Palestine. Also, you know d*mn well that Hamas was the excuse for Israel (and the U.S.) to exterminate, remove Palestinians, even if it meant killing women and children.
Factually wrong.
Hamas won local elections, but these were disputed by the PA. The result was a violent reaction by Hamas, which killed PA officials in Gaza and staged an illegal coup.
They are not a legal government and have no legal standing in Gaza, which legally is part of the PA.
As for the "blockade," it is reasonable to seal your border when an illegal group that openly calls for your murder illegally occupies a territory on your border. The same is true for Egypt, which does not recognize Hamas; in fact, Egypt is at war with the Muslim Brotherhood, the parent group of Hamas.
There is no democracy in Gaza, as the government declared itself to be separate from the PA and has never had elections since seizing power.
As for Israel "exterminating" Palestinians, Israel does not bother Palestinians who don't try to kill them. There are millions of Palestinians in Jordan; Israel and Jordan have a peace treaty, because Jordan does not try to kill Israelis. In fact, Jordan won't accept any more Palestinians, because they tried to kill the leader and take over the country.
Also, you ignore the fact that Palestinians in Israel have the longest life expectancy in the Arab world (more than African Americans…but of course, you only worry about other countries, not your own). That's very brave of you; go put on your keffiyeh and march around Columbia with your pro-Hamas poster to show everyone how brave you are.
The PLO and the PA were/are nothing but lapdogs for the Zionists, acting more like rent a cops than for a government looking after the people of Gaza. Hamas was doing things FOR the citizens. There was a reason Hamas took the election in Gaza with the PA securing a slim majority in the West Bank. You talk about bravery. How brave of the IDF and their constant raids, abducting young men, children as "detainees", doing it in the dead of night. I suppose you think that the IDF was super brave during the "heroic" operation to secure the release of 4 hostages (killing 3 in the process), using perfidy, concealing themselves as displaced Palestinians. Then gunning down 270+,wounding 600+, tearing them piles of wounded flesh form machine gun fire, drone fire, bombs, killing women and children, decapitating a child (https://scheerpost.com/2024/06/09/baby-ahmad-was-beheaded-by-israel-with-a-us-bomb/) the gruesome video of his father holding his son as prime evidence of crime against humanity. Seven paragraphs down, I dare you to click on the "show" to see the video. So brave, the IDF. Guilty of perfidy. Guilty of mayhem. You can go to hell, Alexander!!!!!!!!!
What an absurd collection of falsehoods.
1. The PA is the legal government in the West Bank and Gaza. Signing a peace accord with Israel simply means co-existence, and not harboring people who violently attack their neighbor is part of the agreement, as with any civilized government.
2. Hamas is illegally occupying Gaza and did not allow freedom, elections, or dissent. They were regularly executing anyone they didn't like. And they attacked Israel knowing that Israel would fight back. They kept women and children exposed while they hid in tunnels, for the effect this would have on naive and uninformed people in the West. Even the other Arabs aren't buying it.
3. I think that countries should try to return their citizens who have been kidnapped; you seem to have a problem with that. That is too absurd to even discuss.
3. I don't dispute that war is bloody, but that is why you don't attack a powerful military. If Hamas had attacked North Korea, Russia, India, China, or the United States, they would experience the same fate, as did Al-Qaeda and ISIS. It is criminal that Hamas keeps hostages among civilians; doing so is profoundly irresponsible, as the results are predictable.
What I don't see in your comments is any criticism of Hamas. You seem to see them as people's heroes, yet they do nothing for the people except bring death. Gaza could have been a prosperous and peaceful territory. Billions of dollars flowed into Gaza; but Hamas stole it and used it for bombs, guns, ammunition, RPGs, IEDs, tunnels, and other military equipment.
As for Hell, it can be found on earth, when you chooses war over peace. Hamas knew exactly what would happen when they killed 1,200 Israelis; you are free to believe otherwise; but even the Arab nations are staying out of this conflict because they see Hamas for what it is. But if you feel that strongly, I suggest to go to Gaza and join Hamas – like the Lincoln Brigade in Spain. Think it over.
What about the human rights of the Palestinian people? They ELECTED Hamas, it is a legal political entity. Hamas are the children of Palestinian parents and siblings for whom the Hamas resistance fights and is willing to die.
The IDF does NOT fighting Hamas, IDF are the terrorists killing unarmed women and children.
The Zionist are brutal and sadistic war criminals. Starving children to death takes no courage, sadism yes, and that is no honor for the most moral army the world has ever seen, the IDF./s
” They ELECTED Hamas, which then canceled all subsequent elections for the following 17 years, brutally suppressed street protests against its misrule, executed political opponents as ‘Israeli spies,’ and finally brought Israel in as ‘worse cop’ to its ‘bad cop’ in order to maintain its grip on power.”
Fixed, no charge.
Actually, Hamas won legislative elections, although despite the ubiquitous Jimmy Carter quotes, there was plenty of evidence of Hamas interference.
"R. Michael Alvarez argued that "despite all the progress, however, the voting process was plagued by a series of manipulations. Violations were committed by both major political parties, namely Fatah and Hamas. Although, the observers reported, Hamas had an advantage in mobilizing Palestinian facilities for its own political purposes."
A period of conflict between Hamas and Fatah followed the election, which resulted in a breakdown of the government. Hamas illegally took over the Gaza Strip on June 14 2007, and PA Chairman Mahmoud Abbas dismissed the Hamas-led coalition government. So, legally, Hamas has no basis for controlling Gaza.
You left out the part about Hamas illegally occupying Gaza. They did not win elections allowing them to stage a coup, which they did.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2006_Palestinian_legislative_election#Campaign
Thomas, we all know Americans will declare any election illegal if the wrong people got elected. They meddle in all elections, Remember Kiev and Nuland? State department and CIA destabilize societies and set up coups against elected governments. CIA agents are in all embassies around the world, with diplomatic privileges', that includes NATO allies.
So, why the brutal blockade that harms no Hamas but the Palestinians citizens? What did they do other than vote. Hamas "illegally occupying Gaza"? Are you out of your mind. Next you are going to allege that Hamas occupies Israel. Wow.
Yes, Hamas illegally occupies Gaza. It's a simple legal issue. Hamas is not the legal government in Gaza – the Palestinian Authority is, based on internationally recognized accords.
Hamas received a majority in local elections. Winning local elections doesn't mean you allowed to kill PA members and stage a violent coup and grab Gaza in violation of international law.
So, apparently, I'm not "out of my mind".
BULL SH*T.
I guess if you had a decent argument, you would have presented it, but since you can't, you don't.
It is a waste of time to debate with a closed mind, so, why bother?
Thanks for confirming my point. You can't defend your position with the most simple, basic facts. You only have rude, childish outbursts, not arguments.
I consider the source, your post is meaningless to me. Other than allegations you have nothing to offer.
What I posted speaks for itself.
Nice of you, could you please fix the Ukrainian elections?
Zelensky's term has ended, he now is an illegal president, he had canceled the elections. The Azov people are on the rise, Biden is releasing weapons for them again.
I don't know what that is all about, they do need more soldiers to fight.
Maybe they could have a replacement for Zelensky.
Fixed all right. Well, why would they want elections when they mean nothing to the U.S. and to Israel? Why?
Thomas, immediately after the election the Zionists imposed sanctions and denied the election which the observers have called fair and square. They made sure Hamas could not build an economy with the air, sea, and land borders under total Israeli control. That is history and you know it too.
Fatah lost because they did nothing for the people, witness Abbas and his PA on the WB, they are Israel's hired hands against their own Palestinian people. Palestinians are getting killed and robbed blind on the WB and the whole world watches and does nothing, Hamas did, they make the whole world look in the mirror and see the little spineless human beings they are. Morally totally bankrupt people.
Thomas, I can’t let you off the hook, I asked, “Do Palestinians have basic human rights?”
I asked many times, and believe you me, not once did I get a straight YES or NO answer. The responses, if any, are either obfuscating the issue, or ad hominin insults.
Of course Palestinians have basic human rights.
And the Israeli regime and Hamas are long-time allies in violating those basic human rights.
There is no “hook” for you to “let me off of.” Nobody owes you answers just because you happen to want them.
Thanks, and a follow up question, exactly what human rights of the Palestinian people has Hamas violated and did the Israelis violate any human rights of the Palestinians, including women and children.
When people (not you) accuse me of lying, I have a right to ask for an explanation. I insist on my right to my opinion based on what I know and believe to be true facts, I don’t have to believe what others tell me I have to believe because they think they know better and they own the truth.
The Israeli regime, like Hamas, is a frequent violator of human rights. In the case of Hamas the violations of Palestinian human rights include violent suppression of protests against its misrule and its refusal to hold elections, as well as its murder of political dissidents on charges of “collaborating with Israel” (something which Hamas itself has done since its founding).
If all you say is true, that is not different from what we are doing. Did Zelensky not cancel the election? He killed and imprisoned opposition leaders, he even has a death list of opponents, including foreigners. Actually, he sold his nation’s young men for cannonfodder for American interests, he is a traitor of his nation and would be on death row if not already dead if he were an American and did to us what he did to Ukrainians. That goes for Scholz in Germany too. Here and in Europe you get fired if you criticize Israel, why can’t Hamas do that? .
In what universe do you imagine that I support the Ukrainian regime or the US regime or the German regime any more than I support the Israeli regime, the Hamas regime, or the Russian regime?
I'm an anarchist. All your murder gangs look the same to me.
Thomas, I did not say you support the Ukrainian regime or any regime at all. You are not an anarchist either , you don’t like government, but you do nothing to change it, you are in the audience.
All I did with my question was putting the issue on the table to compare. I did compare and stick to my moral judgement and simple common sense political judgement which is, we have a government consisting of irrational, incompetent punks, unable to know right from wrong morally.
” You are not an anarchist either”
I strongly suspect that I know more about my political views than you know about my political views.
I am sure you do know more about your political views, but you know when you post you display your views if you are honest. I do think you honestly believe what you say.
How can Hamas hold elections when Israel has been assassinating its leaders? In 1864 the confederacy didn’t have F-16’s, suicide drones or helicopter gunships targeting candidates and polling places in the North
Do you have any way of telling whether the people executed by Hamas were collaborators or dissidents?
Do you have any citations for Hamas violently suppressing dissidents?
Nope. Hamas is not a legal government and was not elected. It won local elections, which the PA disputed. The result was that Hamas started killing PA officials and staged a coup in Gaza. They illegally occupy the territory, which has no international recognition.
Hamas uses terror as a tactic to fight a larger enemy. As with 9/11, the brutal attack was meant to trigger a response. Hamas used the anticipated deaths of women and children – who were not allowed to leave and were used as human shields – as part of their strategy. They figured Westerners are weak and afraid to cause civilian deaths, as Israel has backed down before. Or the felt the PR benefit would be worth it.
In fact, Israel did not fall for this trick, because rewarding Hamas for the use of human shields would only encourage more attacks. The only way to stop Hamas was to destroy Hamas. That is what they are doing.
Israelis do not attack people who do not try to kill them. They have peace treaties with Egypt and Jordan, and maybe Saudi Arabia. Israel left Gaza in 2005, and Gaza could be a peaceful and prosperous territory. All they had to do was stop killing Israelis. But they couldn't. So, here we are.
You have your narrative set in stone. I have heard it all, but what you can’t tell me do the Palestinian people have human rights, and if so what are they? I can never get an answer, I would like to know.
It's a legal question. Rights are based on governments, so it depends on what government they live under (Israel, the PA, Lebanon, Iraq, Jordan, etc.). Currently in Gaza, there is no legal, internationally recognize government.
Palestinians in Israel have rights based on the Israeli constitution. In fact, Israeli Arabs generally have more rights than those in other Arab/Muslim countries. Some Muslims (like the Ba'hai) have moved to Israel to get the rights they don't have in their home country (Iran).
Because we don't have a world government, there is no such thing as universal rights, although people like to trot them out sometimes when convenient.
I personally like the rights provided to US citizens by the US Constitution, but that only applies to US citizens.
It is also a MORAL question, it is about just and fair. The American Constitution has nothing to do with it. Human rights, Justice, fairness is a moral question about honesty, simple human decency which our elite does not have.
The rights in the Constitution depend on the people who control the government. Money and politics shape the government.
We have an intellectually and morally corrupt and bankrupt elite in government. The donor class, the wealthiest lobbies rule the land. That is why there is a low voter turnout, trust in government is shrinking, and our working middle class is shrinking, and millionaires become billionaires and soon trillionaires.
Which means, you do not believe Palestinian women and children have rights. The Israeli constitution???? Rights??? They do not have the same rights as Jews in Israel and you know it.
Not sure what you are asking. Do Israeli Arabs have rights in Israel under the Israeli Constitution? Yes, they do.
Do Arabs have the same rights as Jews? Nope. However, Israeli Arabs have more rights than they do in other Arab countries, and your country (the US?) does not provide equal rights to all of its citizens.
Maybe you've heard of BLM and George Floyd, and the prison industry in America? But I'm sure you don't care about that.
In fact, all countries have one group that is favored over another. In Saudi Arabia, the Shia as second class. In India, it's Muslims. In Iran, it's Ba'hai and Sunnis. In Pakistan, it's Shia. I'm sure you are very upset about all of these countries, including your own.
I don't want to know what you like, I want to know what rights the Palestinian people have, do they have HUMAN RIGHTS, THE RIGHT TO EXIST?
I don't think anyone has an absolute right to exist. Absolute rights are an abstraction and meaningless without any sort of society and enforcement. People form societies to establish things such as rights, but there are no free-floating rights without some type of society. So, rights are relative to the society a person is in. However, people who oppose abortion say that every fetus has the right to life.
Your answer is abstract obfuscation and meaningless.
“I don’t think anyone has an absolute right to exist” Who has the right to limit or deny the right to exist. You went off topic when you pulled in the fetus question in disguise which is, when does life begin.
My view is my opinion. I have a lot of opinions. You are free to have your own.
Here's some more: I think John was more talented than Paul. I think all religions are based on unfounded stories, but I think there is some higher power. I prefer chocolate to vanilla. I think U2 is overrated. I think Orson Welles was a genius, and "The Third Man" was amazing. I think the United States relies too much on cars and should develop urban transit and high-speed rail. I think we should invest the $450 billion we spend on sports each year on medical research.
If you want more opinions, let me know. If they upset you, then don't.
As to who has the right to limit or deny the right to exist, we do that all the time. We deny the right to exist to people who commit crimes. We legally allow people to kill themselves in some countries. We kill fetuses during an abortion. We kill lots people during wars. We kill people in self-defense if they attack us or threaten us. Last year, we killed 21,593 fellow Americans in homicides. We have "do not resuscitate" labels on many elderly or dying patients, which means we withhold life-saving measures from them. And so on.
I really don’t care about your opinion.
Then why did you ask about it?
The IDF massacres women and children and bombs hospital, schools, churches, infrastructure, all civilian targets, they deny food and medical care and housing for women and children, snipers slaughter unarmed people. That is not fighting a war, it is genocide massacre. The whole world knows it.
Hamas staged an attack knowing how Israel would respond. They keep women and children as human shields, so Westerners will get upset and stop supporting Israel.
Allowing Hamas to engage in this grotesque tactic will only encourage other groups to do the same. That is the purpose of a terror tactic, which Hamas used.
"The whole world" is not as naive as most Americans. They know exactly what Hamas did, and why.
You know who isn't falling for the cynical strategy of Hamas, offering their own people as a sacrifice for PR? Egypt. Jordan. Saudi Arabia. Turkey. Even Hezbollah and Iran aren't buying it.
So, you are free to feel self-righteous and post about "genocide" etc., but the whole world knows a fraud when they see one, even if you don't.
It was a natural to be expected prison outbreak of an extremely brutal inhumane prison camp. The Israeli brutality caused it. There will be no peace as long as there is a Zionist Israel. Zionists are EVIL.
There is nothing "natural" about Hamas slaughtering human beings, and suggesting that is legitimizing extreme brutality.
Gaza is not a prison, and the brutal attack on Israeli civilians was not a prison break. It was a terrorist attack calculated to get a response, which it did, as planned.
Israel left Gaza in 2005 and would leave it alone if they stopped killing Israelis. The only obstacle to peace is Hamas, which is dedicated to destroying Israel. Israel lives peacefully with Arabs who do not try to kill them, such as those in Jordan and Egypt, and even Saudi Arabia.
Israel is a country dedicated to providing a home for Jews (Zionism), so that won't change. There is nothing inherently evil about seeking a homeland for your people.
The Jews sought to achieve this goal through the UN plan in 1947, but the Arabs preferred to settle it by war. So, there was a war but they lost. Then they said wars doesn't count. Hamas continues this tradition, preferring war to negotiations. They also try to use the deaths of their women and children in a grotesque strategy to continue the war from 1947. The strategy does influence uninformed people in the Western world, but even the Arabs don't buy it and see Hamas (and the Muslim Brotherhood) for what they are.
So, your comments lack any accuracy.
The USA has become a rogue state, it makes the laws and breaks them as it sees fit.
They have no authority to decide another nation's election is legal or not. In their eyes the only legal and fair elections are the regime changes they make.
Are Palestinians human beings? Do they have red blood and feel pain? Do Palestinians have HUMAN RIGHTS like you and I and the Israelis have?
Do Israelis use terror as a tactic or not? They are simple and easy common sense Yes or No questions.
If Hamas is the legal political entity for Gaza, than Israel war is not against Hamas but against all of Gaza. The Nazis were the legal entity for Germany, thus the British were free to pound the German cities.
The Israelis are the NAZIS, the Palestinians are the victims. The IDF is fighting unarmed civilians, 60% women and children, who are unprotected against a well equipped American armed IDF, two nuclear powers ganging up on women and children. Are you proud of that? Where is Hamas anyway, are they spirits the Zionists paint on the walls for propaganda purposes?
Bombing civilian targets are war crimes no matter who does it, Hiroshima and Nagasaki are war crimes, there was no military reason to bomb civilians, Dresden was filled with refugees, it was not a military target at all, mostly women and children and old men, another war crime at the end of the conflict.
Honestly, do you have authority to certify elections? Bombing cities is a war crime, they are not military targets. But war crimes are legal if the Western democracies, the value societies do it.
Hamas is not a legal government. They illegally occupy Gaza. They won local elections that were disputed; during this dispute, Hamas conducted a violent coup and grabbed Gaza, a move that lacks international recognition.
The legal government in Gaza is the PA.
According to Hamas's charter they want to destroy Israel. Sinwar believes he is on the right path to do so.
I don't dispute that.
The crunch will come when the U.S. tries to impose a rent-an-arab "peacekeeping" force on Gaza. This will be resisted and the war will continue. Real estate development + bantustan administration + AI fueled zionist and imperialist death squads will eventually be defeated.
Jared and Sparkle pony build a hotel on the Gaza beach.
Egypt has a lot of history in Gaza, and claimed Gaza after the Israeli-Arab war in 1948. Many Gazan are from Egyptian families (such as Yasser Arafat, who was born in Cairo but whose father was born in Gaza). So, Egypt may play a role in Gaza's future, once Hamas is destroyed (as Hamas is a tool of the Muslim Brotherhood, which is a mortal enemy of Egypt's government).
I'm sure Israel would give up control of Gaza to Egypt. Than that mess would be Egypt's problem. I am also sure that Egypt would not want it back. If Egypt took over, Hamas or its replacement would start attacking Egyptian troops.
Yes, that sounds like a reasonable assessment.
The Arab world, from what I can tell, is divided between pro-Western (US, EU, UK, Israel) factions (Egypt, Jordan, Saudi Arabia, Turkey, etc.) and anti-Western factions (Iran, Syria, Iraq, Afghanistan, Yemen, Somalia, Sudan, etc.).
The Arab world is built from the ashes of empires that were once larger than the Roman. Groups like Al-Qaeda, ISIS, Hamas, and the Muslim Brotherhood openly seek to restore former glory to the Arab world, while pro-Western countries do not.
Egypt feels that the Muslim Brotherhood is an existential threat to their country – and Hamas is part of the MB, so they have no objection to Israel doing the dirty work and removing Hamas from their border (which they closed when Hamas grabbed Gaza in a coup).
So, what will happen in Gaza? It's hard to say.
How about…Hamas simply stops trying to murder Israelis (and Egyptians)? Sure, it's asking a lot, but then, all those billions of dollars flowing into Gaza could help the people who live there, rather than buying bombs and rockets and guns. Sure, it sounds crazy – not spending millions of killing and attacking a more powerful neighbor – but perhaps they could try it, let their people prosper, and then they would enjoy it? Because, right now, the "attack Israel" approach – not working out for Gazans, in my opinion. You may feel otherwise.
These resolutions mean nothing, waste of time, just another propaganda move by Zionist in D.C., to make the world think America is still trying to STOP the Genocide. All BS! Blinken, Biden, Sullivan, Kirby, ETC., all need to be charged with Crimes Against Humanity, that should be the start of the Peace Process.
Kirby is the worst. How in the h*ll did he become a Vice Admiral? Constant warmongering gibberish emotes from his blow hole.
The USA and Israel are not fighting a war, they are not fighting Hamas, they are ganging up fighting together an unarmed small nation, more than 60% women and children.
The quality of our leadership and officials could not be lower than it is. They are dehumanized spineless sl*my sc*m.
Can you explain how a "unarmed" nation managed to kill over 1500 citizens of Israel?
Considering the years of slow motion genocide it may total up, I do know that the Israeli firepower killed most of the Israeli people Oct. 7, many were IDF soldiers. The Kibbutz along the Gaza fence are military posts. Israelis are still investigating what happened, they should be able to publish the results soon. I do know that at least some 40 000 Palestinians have been massacred, killed since Oct. more than 60% women and children many with 2000 pound bombs dropped on civilian private properties including schools and hospitals and churches and no evidence that Hamas used the properties. There is much more unthinkable savage brutality, like surgery without anesthetics, including the the amputation of young children, slow death by starvation including children. Imagine the torture the parents must suffer watching their starving children dying a slow and painful death. Only savage and insane criminal government officials and citizens can support such savage cruelty. Only insane voters can vote for such monsters.
I know that you know that Hamas knows that Biden knows he will not make Israel abide to a "permanent ceasefire." Dude! I even remember both Biden and Israel blamed Hamas in advance for never having a "permanent ceasefire."
Hamas exists for one purpose – to exterminate Israel. That's its goal, stated unambiguously in their charter and by their actions. So, the only permanent ceasefire is the complete destruction of Hamas.
However, Israel just asks one thing from its neighbors: Don't kill their people. They have peace treaties with Jordan and Egypt based on that simple principle. In fact, it left Hamas alone until recently. When they killed its people.
Mr. Bidette can stop the aggression with a phone call and cessation of transfer of weapons, and, remove support personnel who assisted the IDF in its "heroic" rescue.
And it might snow in Miami this year. But the odds are slim and the odds that USA abandon Israel is also slim.
Médecins Sans Frontières reports Latest massacres in Gaza illustrate the complete dehumanisation of Palestinians https://www.msf.org/
Contrary to the repeated public communications of the Israeli authorities, humanitarian aid has been denied or severely impeded since October. The lack of essential medical supplies and equipment, the bureaucratic delays from Israeli authorities in granting security and supply approval to establish field hospitals, have made it near impossible to provide even basic healthcare. Field hospitals are only necessary because the healthcare system in Gaza has been systematically dismantled – they can in no way replace a robust and functional healthcare system.
More than 37,000 men, women and children have been killed in Gaza and more than 84,000 wounded according to the Ministry of Health. The Security Council resolution of 10 June must be implemented without delay: safe zones are non-existent in Gaza, International Humanitarian Law principles are not being upheld, and humanitarian aid is systematically being impeded. There must be an immediate and sustained ceasefire, and unfettered humanitarian aid must be allowed to enter Gaza at scale.
How can the Western democracies stand by and even fund the massacres the IDF and the Israelis commit on unarmed Gazan civilians, more than 60% women and children. Such savageries like denial of food ,water, shelter, medical supply and basic sanitation they can do to children, but not armed soldiers. It could not happen against an army but against defenseless women and children.
This is not a war, it is a massacre of mainly women and children and they claim it all on Hamas, because Hamas dare to fight the Israelis for their human rights, the rights of their parents and siblings, no one else will lift a finger for their humanity, their human rights, therefore they are the criminals and the viscous poor Israelis are the victims.
And poor ignorant Biden people have no evidence yet genocide is happening under their eyes.
Netanyahu and Biden's WH are both equally pathological liars whose pronouncements aren't worth spit.
The two actors continue their grotesque pursuit of the complete ethnic cleansing of Gaza, to be followed by elimination of the Palestinian existence in the West Bank.
If we want to see progress, the world needs to see the main actors of both governments in irons in the Hague. Otherwise, absolutely nothing will change: the Israelis will continue to pollute and undermine the US political system, and Israel will continue to threaten the peaceful existence of the entire Middle East.
"Hamas Responds to Biden’s Ceasefire Dodge and Hustle to lessen the stain of Israeli monstrosities on his 'coronation prospects'"
Like a said, a circus. Everyone knows there will be no ceasefire. This is all done for PR purposes for Biden's election campaign. The Russians saw through it. So did Hamas. As I've said before, this is all bullshit like Biden's year long Iranian JPOA "negotiations" which were doomed to fail from Day One. Neither the US nor Israel want "negotiations" to succeed until all the Palestinians are dead or expulsed. For that matter, neither does Hamas – since they're winning.