The International Court of Justice (ICJ) ruled that Israel’s actions in Gaza could plausibly amount to genocide. The ICJ ordered several injunctions on Israel but stopped short of ordering a ceasefire in Gaza.
Late last year, South Africa filed charges in an 84-page indictment against Israel at the ICJ, alleging Tel Aviv is conducting genocide. Earlier this month, a 17-judge panel at the ICJ heard two days of arguments from lawyers representing the South African charges and Israeli defense.
On Friday, the ICJ announced it had ordered several limitations on how Tel Aviv should wage war in Gaza, including that Israel punish soldiers who commit war crimes and allow more aid into the besieged Strip. The ICJ was not expected to rule if the actions of Israeli politicians and military amount to genocide. Still, the court deemed South Africa’s claims that Israel was committing genocide in Gaza have sufficient merit to move forward.
The ICJ judges voted on the decisions 15-2 and 16-1. The “no” votes came from Judge Julia Sebutinde of Uganda and Ad Hoc Judge Aharon Barak of Israel. American Judge Joan Donoghue leads the court. Before joining the ICJ, she served as a foreign policy adviser in the Barack Obama administration.
South Africa argued to the court that Israeli forces had inflicted widespread death and devastation across Gaza in just three months. Additionally, Pretoria’s lawyers presented evidence that top Israeli officials, including Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu, had made statements calling for the genocide of Palestinians that were heeded by Israeli soldiers fighting in Gaza.
The Minister of International Relations in South Africa, Naledi Pandor, celebrated the ruling as a victory. “I would thank the judges of the ICJ for dealing with the matter expeditiously.” She continued, “The state of Israel is called upon by the judges to act to protect civilians and to protect [them from] the massive level of harm that we have seen since the Israeli action began.”
Pandor argued the ICJ ruling amounted to a de facto ceasefire. “How do you provide aid and water without a ceasefire?” she said. “If you read the order, by implication, a ceasefire must happen.”
However, there is resentment towards the court for failing to order an Israeli ceasefire. “There is a great deal of frustration and resentment because the one element that every single Palestinian across the Gaza Strip, including children, were waiting for is an end to this madness, a cessation of all hostilities and of the ongoing intense bombing,” Hani Mahmoud reported for Al Jazeera from inside Gaza.
While Tel Aviv has said that it will ignore the ICJ ruling and Washington has routinely dismissed South Africa’s genocide argument as meritless, the ruling will likely do significant damage to Israel’s reputation around the globe.
Executive Vice President of the Quincy Institute, Trita Parsi, explained that the ruling was a massive victory for the Palestinian movement. “This is a devastating blow to Israel’s global standing.” He posted on X. “To put it in context, Israel has worked ferociously for the last two decades to defeat the BDS movement – Boycott, Divestment, and Sanctions – not because it will have a significant economic impact on Israel, but because of the manner that it could delegitimize Israel internationally.”
Paris’s post continued, “However, the ruling of the ICJ that Israel is plausibly engaged in genocide is far more devastating to Israel’s legitimacy than anything BDS could have achieved.”
President Joe Biden has maintained his unconditional support for Israel. Washington has continued to supply Tel Aviv with bombs, even as Israel has used American weapons to attack civilian targets in Gaza.
Support for Israel is becoming a political liability for Biden’s 2024 reelection campaign. His events are regularly disreputed by protesters chanting “genocide Joe.” The campaign hired an adviser to help mitigate the impact of the protesters.
However, the President is struggling in polls against his Republican challengers. One survey showed Biden lagging behind former President Donald Trump among young and Hispanic voters. An Economist poll released this week shows that nearly half of the voters in those demographics believe Israel is committing genocide in Gaza. Overall, a third of Americans said Israel was committing genocide in Gaza, before the ICJ ruling.
It is unclear how the White House will respond to the ruling. On Thursday, when asked if parties should abide by whatever the ICJ rules, State Department spokesman Vedant Patel refused to answer. “I would not opine on anything like that given this is a legal process, and I’m not going to hypothesize or speculate on any kind of outcome,” he said.
Patel added, “The allegations that Israel is committing genocide we believe to be unfounded.”
Kyle Anzalone is the opinion editor of Antiwar.com, news editor of the Libertarian Institute, and co-host of Conflicts of Interest.
What a wildly misleading headline
Was there any part of the ruling that DIDN’T go against Israel?
Israel’s contentions pursuant to the charges:
1) “Israel contends that SouthAfrica has failed to demonstrate the prima facie jurisdiction of the Court under Article IX of the Genocide Convention.” (The court ruled that South Africa had indeed demonstrated prima facie jurisdiction)
2) “Israel further argues that the acts complained of by South Africa are not capable of falling within the provisions ofthe Genocide Convention because the necessary specific intent to destroy, in whole or in part, the Palestinian people as such has not been proved, even on a prima facie basis.” (The court ruled that such intent was proven on a prima facie basis)
Israel will continue to “defend” itself. Not stop. And there is wriggle room in the ruling. Not that they would have followed a cease fire in any case. But calling for a cease fire writ large would have required the US to explain its commitment to military aid during an international court’s cease fire determination.
The US could “explain” that with a 30-second response to a question by an assistant press secretary. If the question ever arose in a way that compelled a response.
I know they would bullshit and dance around it. But there are some members in congress who would have good cause to bring this up which would then be reported. Someone like Massey, for example, would no doubt bring up a cease fire ruling.
All, democrat or republican, will dance quickly away, fearful of the AIPAC machine. The money machine.
I think it’s deeper than that. One nation is a satellite of the other. Which one is the real “empire” is a question that remains unanswered for me.
It is well known that Israel has the most effective PR machine the world has ever seen.
Not lately.
So we are graced with an expert on world history for the past 10,000 years.
Like,so what?
Which is laughable. Many times, Netanyahu and others in his administration and in the IDF voiced their desire to get rid of the Palestinians. Actions followed their desire, using “dumb” 2,000 pound bombs for maximum destruction effect.
The headline here is akin to Kyle Anzalone being tried for murder and instead being found guilty of reckless endangerment and headlines the next day read:
“Jury finds Kyle Anzalone guilty in capital murder case.”
Its intentionally misleading, I’d expect no less
You write quite well for someone who seemingly can’t read.
I’ll take the ad hominem as a concession that my point is correct.
I find much of what is happening in Gaza appalling, but the arguments made and the mental gymnastics Ron Paul’s disciples are doing is so disingenuous
The court ruled against Israel on jurisdiction, it ruled against Israel on interim measures, and it ruled in favor of Israel on [fill in the blank if you have an answer].
Ron Paul’s disciples hate my guts for noticing that he’s just another lying politician. Try again if you’d like.
It’s hilarious how zionists just can’t see themselves. The illegal basis for the creation of the zionist colony will now come more and more into focus. Perhaps 181 will be revisited. European Genocide, Ethnic Cleansing, and Collective Punishment were never Palestine’s problem.
“Perhaps 181 will be revisited” What is to revisited? Israel accepted the plan and became a nation.
While Tel Aviv has said that it will ignore the ICJ ruling and Washington has routinely dismissed South Africa’s genocide argument as meritless, the ruling will likely do significant damage to Israel’s reputation around the globe.
This would have been the case even if a cease fire had been ordered. I’ll take it as a win for the Palestinians.
“I’ll take it as a win for the Palestinians” Yes, it a PR win, just what Hamas wanted. They traded 25,000 lives to get this win.
A good PR is also important. It makes it difficult for other Arab governments to look other way. And not only for Arab governments.
If they do, then their neighbors must realize that they will not step in to aid them. So far, Arab governments have not lifted a finger to assist the Palestinians over the 75 years of occupation.
Read more,before you speak. Wars in 1948,1967,1973-Arabs got their butts kicked,and now have their own problems.
Hamas didn’t kill 25,000 civilians.
The war they started on Oct 7 resulted in their deaths. That is the root cause. BTW, does that 25K figure include Hamas fighters and operatives?
By your twisted logic I could claim that Israel was responsible for all the deaths on Oct. 7th given that they have been killing Palestinians for years before that date. Do you see how warped you mind is?
Fact: no Oct 7 attack, no Gaza destruction 2023/2024. I am sure your mind is having trouble dealing with that.
Are you really so stupid you don’t get how logic works? I can play this game too. Fact: no 70 years of persecution, apartheid, and killings; no Oct 7 attack.
The point is that no right minded person is going to argue that some previous atrocity justifies any retaliatory atrocity.
Not as stupid as you. A simple fact, which even you can not deny. No 10/7 attack, no destruction in Gaza. It is not about justification it is about facts.
Of course, the Oct 7th attack set off Israel’s genocide. That’s why Israel allowed it to happen. Otherwise, the status quo of Gaza being an outdoor prison would still be in place. But somehow in your sick mind, that genocide is justified.
It is good that you understand the difference between facts and justification. Some people don’t. Now if I can just get to understand the difference between genocide and collateral damage.
It’s not “collateral” when it’s openly announced as the objective.
It is good that you understand the difference between facts and justification. Some people don’t.
Yes, some people don’t. You.
Now if I can just get to understand the difference between genocide and collateral damage.
Do some simple math. That’ll get you started. Collateral damage shouldn’t mean the vast majority. As in the vast majority killed in Gaza have been innocents. The vast majority of the 400,000 in famine are innocents. ect. ect.
https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/adcf406c51d4c3d6d0cc4020b66ad161ca1bf45869d7b414263a855dc8ce4ece.jpg
You are acting like Israel is a rabid dog. Israel has agency and can make choices. It doesn’t have commit genocide against the Palestinians, but it is.
Yes Israel made a choice to defend it self and try to protect its southern border. And in fighting with the enemy, there have been civilians losses. That is a fact of urban warfare, which Hamas choose. Israel did not chose the battle space. There is no way to fight against an enemy dug in forts underground in a city without losses to civilians. Hamas calls these losses genocide to cover up the mess they started on 10/7.
You can obfuscate, whitewash, and make excuses all you want. The ICJ has ruled that Israel must stop it’s genocidal actions. The prima facie case has been made according to the most senior judges on the planet. So you and your fascist friends are now on notice.
Yes, it like getting a warning from a police to not speed. Notice that ICJ did not order Israel to stop its attack on Gaza or to leave Gaza. Thus confirming the right of Israel to defend itself and by extension the right to exist. The ICJ just wants them to be more careful.
See the ICJ ruling paragraphs 78-81, 86. I understand that you are divorced from reality and will twist the ICJ ruling to fit your warped ideology, but it is right there in plain English. It’s not like a warning from a traffic cop as that doesn’t end up on the gallows like the current Israeli leadership will hang from if they don’t change course. It may already be too late for them.
Where were the most senior judges when Arafat and his ilk pranced around killing Israeli civilians? NO WHERE.
You can engage in “whataboutisms” till the cows come home and it ain’t gonna change the fact that what is going on right now in Gaza is genocide.
https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/dab151c2220d94dbe520233942bd8db48bf77c4b79050000bb08b41cd8daad19.jpg
“Israel did not chose the battle space.”
When Israel confined the resents of Gaza in an open air prison, they chose the battle space.
Israel is sending a message-slaughter us, and we will slaughter many more of you-give pain, get more,with interest.
That is genocidal talk and it is clear that if concepts of proportionality are applied they are way out of bounds by any measure. Either way their actions are now on display for the entire world to see. It is now clear how barbaric and bloodthirsty Israeli culture has become. It seems their collective trauma from the holocaust has led them to become butchers. Much like the phenomenon where abused children often grow up to be abusers themselves.
Genocidal (acceptance/cheerleading) talk = all (damn near) of jakes comments.
Pretty much every comment from Jake and Tim are either cheering on or justifying genocide. I haven’t seen such blood lust since right after 911.
Check the comment made by Hamas supporters on 10/7.
Are their calls to wipe out all the Israelis?
“genocidal…cheerleading…(damn near [all]) of jakes comments.”
yep, clear siding with genocide is rarely as open as with genocide jake…
…ah…not counting the routine utterances of multiple israeli high officials…
“That is genocidal talk” –
classic genocide jake:
‘slaughter us we will slaughter many more of you’ – geno-jake’s approving version of netanyahu’s genocidal /collective punishment “amalek” reference…
…same remorseless refusal to distinguish nonstate militants from noncombatant civilians – ‘there are no innocents’
https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/7bc586f67da029d66c0753a68beab107a741611cc46b38031d330fa064744da6.jpg
The root cause goes back way further than Oct 7th. But you know that. And if Hamas had limited their attack to military targets, Israel would have reacted the same way as it is acting now. And if the IDF had given the organizers of the music event a heads up that an attack was possible, the attack might have been limited to only military targets. But Israel wanted big numbers to justify their planned genocide, so they sacrificed their own people at the music festival to reach that end.
It looks like the IDF killed more Israelis than did Hamas on Oct. 7
The number of innocent people the IDF killed doesn’t absolve Hamas of the innocent people they killed.
Only to you and the Anti-Israel crowd.
Yes, there was an intelligent failure by Israel. But it was not a mastermind plan to attack the Gaza. And if this was some master plan by Israel two questions: 1. Why did Hamas go along with it? and 2. If Israel was planning genocide, why are the civilians losses in
Gaza not substantially higher?
There were warnings from Egypt 3 days before the attack. There were warnings from IDF soldiers about the activities by Hamas for months before the attack. The IDF failed to give the organizers of the music festival heads up about a possible attack. What more do you need? And Mossad knows when two flies are fucking in Gaza, but they didn’t have a clue a massive attack that was rehearsed right in front of their eyes was going to take place?
1. Why did Hamas go along with it?
They didn’t go along with anything. Their attack wasn’t contingent on Israel allowing the attack to happen.
2. If Israel was planning genocide, why are the civilians losses in
Gaza not substantially higher?
How much higher do they have to be? Do the 400,000 currently in famine have to die before you will think it’s enough?
Number 1. The intelligent community in Israel screwed up. That is not the same as some deliberate act.
Number 2. Is a good question. Certainly higher than the current number. Considering the nature of urban combat with an enemy that has built his forts under civilians structures, the un verify numbers of true civilians deaths is what one would expect in this environment. Maybe even a little low.
Screw up? For months on end? How does willful negligence sound? Especially from MOSSASD.
Really? 26,000 dead, 60,000 wounded, 400,000 in famine and 90% of the ENTIRE population has been displaced. 96% of their drinking water was contaminated before the onslaught so we can only imagine what their situation is now. They no longer have an economy. Their schools have been destroyed. Their medical facilities and basically their entire medical system have been destroyed. I guess you must think that if they all aren’t dead by now, this can’t be an ongoing attempt at genocide. The numbers I posted are disgusting. Talking about them as something that should be expected in these situations, as if there just weren’t any other choices, is equally disgusting.
He’s bloodthirsty. We are watching Israel out themselves as brutal butchers. Before they had the veneer of respectability, but now? The majority of the world is appalled and sickened by Israel’s conduct.
Tim Burns won’t admit it is genocide until every last Palestinian in Gaza is dead. Even then he would probably make up excuses for why Israel had to do it or were forced to do it by Hamas.
The hostilities started on 2.Oct with the vicious attack on innocent worshipers at the Al-Aqsa mosque
WRONG! The root cause is the treatment meted out to them by the wonderful Israelis over the last 70 some years. History did not begin on Oct. 7.
History started maybe 3000 years ago. But this round of death and destruction was stared by Hamas on 10/7. 25,000 plus people would still be alive had Hamas not decided to attack.
That is not the root cause, going back to 1948 when the Irgun, the Israeli terrorists, expelled some 750 000 Palestinians from Israel, the Nakba started it and it has never ended for almost a century. That is the historical context.
The Arab armies started the war in 1948. They lost and the expelling of Palestinians was the result of the Arab losing. That is the historical context. Who knows what would have happen if the Arabs were not so foolish. But they were.
The massacre at Deir Yassin happened in April
The Arab militias counter attacked in May
Know the truth and it will set you free
And the Hebron massacre of 1929 set the tone-or will you say it never happened.
Another case of a reaction to a Zionist atrocity. Any child can research today and in a couple of minutes discover the timeline of events in Hebron in the late 1920s.
So enlighten us-what was the justification or provocation for the Hebron massacre?
A series of brutal attacks on the Arab Christians in the area preceded the counter attack.
Just like
2.Oct
Resulted in
7.Oct
And the Hadassah massacre of Jewish doctors and nurses occurred a few days later. A back and forth round of massacres occur in that area for decades.
But you can not deny that with the defeat of the Arab armies from Egypt, Trans-Jordan, Syria and others, ended the return of any Palestinians to new nation of Israel. Coupled that with Jordan annexing the West Bank in 1950 killed the best chance the Palestinians to have their own state. Learn the truth and it will set you free.
Did the Irgun also massacre Jewish doctors and nurses ?
Seems to be been a pattern with these extremist Zionists – killing Jews who resisted.
I’d like to see what would happen here in America if the UN decided that the land here was stolen from the indigenous American Indians by ethnic European settlers and that more than half the land in America should be returned to the American Indians. Every non-Indian person should be forced to leave their homes, businesses, and land and relocate to the eastern side of the Mississippi River. All land west of the Mississippi would be returned to the American Indians because it was their land going back to Old Testament times. Sounds fair doesn’t it?
Would we take a ruling like that lying down?
https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/9696f0c7b0f1fed7a5b8859d42cd3912c0ad319ca3ae2721704e994d74e110da.jpg
And-the Arab nations expelled 750,000 Jews. That is the historical context.
At least. And subjecting people to disease, thirst, famine and no medical care.
They tried, and then were captured or slaughtered.Those Hamas did kill were done in a sadistic fashion.
Trying and doing are two different things. And Israel is killing in the same sadistic fashion but in numbers that dwarf what Hamas did or was capable of doing.
Their goal wasn’t to kill civilians, but to capture them as hostages. It’s becoming more and more clear that a good number of the civilians killed on Oct. 7th were killed by the IDF.
In the end the IDF may have killed most of the Israelis. They had the gunpower Hamas does not have.
BS-they raped,tortured,mutilated and murdered.
Prove it and then talk. There is lots of evidence that the Israelis, the IDF thugs did it and don’t forget the robbing and killing the settlers commit.
Sure, everyone knows the best way to kidnapped someone is to toss hand grenades at them.
Everyone knows the best way to save hostages is to shoot them with Apache helicopters.
Your reply deflects from the fact the Hamas was killing civilians more then kidnapping them. So you know of course that your comment that Hamas goal was not to kill civilians is garbage.
It is quickly becoming apparent that hey kidnapped more people than they killed as a large number of civilians were killed by the IDF to prevent them from being taken hostage. Please break down the numbers for me. How many civilians did Hamas kill? The vast majority killed on Oct. 7th were IDF.
No you breakdown the numbers for me. And show a link to real proof that IDF killed the vast majority of their own.
I can’t because Israel won’t do it. They are the ones with the ability to elucidate this particular point. Why won’t they?
https://w.ynet.co.il/yediot/7-days/time-of-darkness
What does that article say? Can you read Hebrew? If not ask yourself the reason Ynet has not posted it in English. The point is that reporting in the Israeli press has illustrated that a non zero number of Israelis were killed by the IDF on Oct 7th. Given that they were using weapon systems like tanks, apache helicopters, and drones the potential for an extremely high body count is there. Good on the Israeli press for doing this important work holding the murderous IDF accountable.
BS
I am only relaying what the Israeli press is saying. Deny reality all you want.
https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/0176db6b53b5332d7940864de2ad4cd317ee958bcac63b5192c46e854fac6413.jpg
https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/34866c04bd96c0e7c6b8e62ab3ab30930769963c31803d995aa8aaf0211d2cf8.jpg
And the best way to save them is to kill them.
Like beheading babies that didn’t happen. Much or the Oct,7 myth is Israeli BS.
https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/9badd51120780d2fb22b986ddadf9f808a2d4d3716338e44c99b1947f7a65d99.jpg
Since the Israelis started–way back in 1947–to steal Palestinian land and kill Palestinians, there are estimates of up to 5 million Palestinians murdered by Zionists. The 25,000 Palestinian martyrs Israel has recently murdered would not have been the last if this occupation and slow-genocide were allowed to continue.
You do know that Palestinians were also killing Jews. It has never been a one way street.
Where are these estimates from-Mars,or Jupiter?
It’s much more than 25,ooo and it was done by Israel, not Hamas.
And those deaths would not have occurred if Hamas did not this battle. That is a fact. Hamas started the battle. The losses they incurred are on them. No attack, no deaths.
No sick motherf*ckers bringing Hamas to power to thwart a two-state solution, no Hamas. No Hamas, no Oct 7th attack, No Oct 7th attack, no genocide by Israel.
Replace “genocide” with “collateral damage” and you got it right.
If you agree with me then there would be no genocide or “collateral damage” to talk about. I blamed Israel (Netanyahu/Smotrich for Hamas being in power. You agreed. So, once more, no Hamas, no attack.
It will not help to reelect Biden either, it will damage the US reputation as well. They are complicit, so they both will hang together.
The Biden administration is a co-conspirator by providing the means to carry out the attack on the civilian population of Palestine.
Trump will rubber stamp all Israel actions. Bibi if he is still around will make up with Trump.
Trump has been a friend of Israel all along, he moved the embassy and blessed the annexation of the Golan heights and his son in law made lots of money money too. Trump just has a different style and being a conman he does have some charisma and Biden does not have, otherwise they are much the same.
Each and everyone of them should hang.
October 23, 2020: President Trump asked P.M. Netanyahu about his thought “Do you think Sleepy Joe could have made this [Israel/Sudan] deal Bibi, Sleepy Joe,”
“Well Mr. President,” Netanyahu began, “one thing I can tell you is that we appreciate the help for peace from anyone in America, and we appreciate what you’ve done enormously.”
Had Trump got Bibi help in votes, He would have won a second term.
You could could be right. Trump has an issue with the neocons because he is not Russia phobic I think he dared to like Putin. Trump may have made some powerful enemies. This coming election promises to be very interesting.
Would the democrats want a candidate Biden?
No one is going to hang. That’s the pity.
What will do most damage to Biden is his disregard of the court and the rule of law. The greatest damage is therefore yet to come.
This directly impacts his campaign against the lawlessness of Trump.
It will depend upon how allies will react in Europe.
I mean that Biden’s one priority is to re-elect Biden.
This ruling endangers his presumption that support of Israel equals net support for his re-election.
If he calculates that it will cost him votes, he’ll turn on Israel with head-spinning speed.
It contradicts his basic “Trump is lawless” campaign theme, which is a big hit to his re-elction.
It also offends a large part of his existing base. and for example makes it impossible for him to win the swing state of Michigan. He can’t win without the presumed Democratic votes of places now heavily Arab and Muslim.
He’d rather lose than abandon the wars.
I think he is more cynical and power-hungry than that. There is nothing he would not abandon in order to win, even wars.
If the MIC or his plutocratic masters demand it, he’ll dive. But yes, he is a narcissistic psychopath who believes he deserves a second term. He is running with abortion and Trump fearmongering. The latte libs are okay with the genocide. I hear it all the time. They believe he will pick up never Trumpers to replace those abandoning him.
While I agree, I must point out a sore point for me: the “latte libs” are not remotely “liberal” in any meaning of the word. They are not ’60s liberals, and they are not classical economic liberals. They are just power hungry selfish elites with unexamined delusions about themselves.
No disagreement.
The Democrats are always trying to win Republican votes.
They’ll just blame it on anti-Semitism a usual
Like a broken record, here it comes: https://www.caitlinjohnst.one/p/israel-accuses-the-icj-of-you-guessed?r=b6zh7
The sad thing about this too, is that with the Zionists equating Judaism with Zionism, claiming the SA case was merely an act of antisemitism, they will succeed in creating ever more antisemitism across the globe, creating unsafe spaces for all Jewish people, including those who do not abide this terror of anihilation.
Is it my imagination, or do they appear to revel in this proliferation of “antisemitism” thing?
I don’t know if revel is the word I would use.
i’ve held that view…but haveta’ think this one through and see…could work the other way – with israel’s ‘but we’re the victims’ routine less and less believable, exposing a lethal, genocidal state grotesquely pantomiming in ‘jewish victim’ costume…
Look how our media is spinning this
“World Court Rejects Demand for Gaza Cease-Fire” WSJ
“U.N. to Investigate Claim That Employees Participated in Oct. 7 Attack” NYTimes – buries the lead story altogether
“The International Court of Selective Justice” Atlantic
I’m just disgusted with our “free” media, yet again. Thanks Antiwar.com for keeping peaceful viewpoints alive.
What Israeli reputation? The reputation for kicking Palestinians off their land and stealing it? For operating an apartheid state in Gaza and the West Bank? For being racist against Arabs? Hard to see how Israel’s reputation could get any lower. That’s not the reason they’re allowed to pull all this crap.
And you think our average MSM reading citizenship agrees with you? Reading comments on this little blessed echo chamber is refreshing but if I go someplace where people aren’t enlightened (the MSM comment sections), they’ll say those things that you point out is just you being antisemitic.
I was referring to “Israel’s reputation around the globe,” as quoted in the comment to which I responded. I’m not talking about brainwashed Americans who can’t think straight nor critically.
Sorry man. You are correct.
Israel’s actions are a shame to humanity! You don’t need a weatherman to know which way the wind blows. Once again, we are all asked to believe that all that slaughter in Gaza, indiscriminate slaughter (which BTW, Hamas did NOT do on October 7), is NOT genocide or even a war crime! We are asked to deny what we see right before us! The prosecutors of this slaughter are on a cliff and they are about to be pushed over, hence trading THOUSANDS of innocent dead people to stay in power! Absolutely revolting and worthy of public execution!
The world is divided between those who are supporting the genocide of Palestinian people and those who are condemning it. It is difficult to be neutral or indifferent.
With supporting or not supporting Ukrainian neo-Nazism, it was much more comfortable to remain neutral. First of all because the western corporate media propaganda on that issue was much more successful. Second: the opponents of Ukrainian neo-Nazism always were quite capable to hit back, so it wasn’t just only a slaughter of the innocent. Third: the genocide of Donbass people was a bit of a lesser scale and not so successful.
It is difficult for European governments to support aggressive Zionism also because they have a lot of Arab and other Muslim migrants. Some days ago there was a massive protest in Birmingham where Jeremy Corbyn had a great speech. I hope many of those who voted against Corbyn in the last elections regretted about their choice.
More like some countries are blungeoned into going along with the U.S.
Money (worthless) or weapons dangled before their leader’s eyes.
Sanctions are imposed if needed.
There is one factor we must not overlook, Europeans are not sovereign, they act in favor of American interests against their own people. The USA has the thump on the scale in Europe, in the EU as well as NATO, a corporate owned and controlled media spreads the neocon narrative.
Scholz is a good exempla, he is the German Zelensky, he sold the nation with help from the Greens and the CIA.
Arabs in many countries can be a significant voting bloc. Here, in the U.S. of Atrocities, Biden has lost that bloc.
So they are going to vote for Trump? If they think that Trump will help their cause they are mistaken.
Then you should embrace Trump. He accused Obama/Biden of not being subservient enough towards Israel and proved it by kissing their ass beyond anything done by previous presidents. So, the genocide will probably see an uptick with Trump which should please you.
The UN violated the first article of its own charter in recognising a self declared state by a minority demographic occupying entity within a class A mandated territory.
The elements justifying the creation of the nation of Israel were not there.
That is your opinion. The big boys at the time, USSR and the USA disagreed.
Who created Switzerland and Bhutan?-the people did themselves.Israel would have been forced to announce their independence w/o the approval o fothers.People elope all the time.
Excellent. Spot on. Israel is an illegal state created by an illegal partition. The only correct solution is to reverse that decision, take control of Palestine – including present Israel – back under the UN, then create a new single state of Palestine.
“the ruling will likely do significant damage to Israel’s reputation around the globe.”
Israel was founded on the acts of terrorism and violence. What on earth does anyone thinks they care about a bad reputation?
Just as President Kennedy feared, when Israel got the bomb, which President Kennedy was adamantly against, Israel indeed got more aggressive. The Zionists in Israel at the time were happy to see him gone.
Daddy Kennedy pulled baby Kennedy’s strings-what could one expect? If the UK and France could build Nukes-so could Israel-more than just-beautiful.
Only,when Israel was offered UN 181,they accepted-Arabs refused. In the US-they tared and feathered Royalists-we no longer do that.
“Only,when Israel was offered UN 181,they accepted-Arabs refused”
Exactly. Israel bought the UNR 181 ticket. So it’s stuck taking the UNR 181 ride. No UNR 181, no Israel.
Not at all.If yo want to sell your home,I offer you one million.You say no-fine.Then 10 years later you say you will accept the 1 million.Then I say no-all well and good. There are no do overs in life.
Except that Israel offered to accept UNR 181 in return for statehood and UN membership, and the offer was accepted.
Now that the deal has been done for 75 years, they don’t get to give back UNR 181 but keep the statehood and UN membership.
The Palestinian Arabs rejected the deal for a similar state, but that doesn’t magically undo UNR 181 where Israel is concerned, any more than your neighbor turning down an offer for his house means your mortgage goes away.
“keep the statehood and UN membership” They do. It is called reality. You consider that Israel cheated on 181 but so what? 75 years have past by and Israel border with Egypt and Jordan are now set by treaties between those countries, which over rides the 181 in real world.
Israel had no power to negotiate borders that gave land allocated to an Arab state of Palestine under UNR 181 to itself.
If you don’t shake hands on the deal-no deal. If you want to sell me your house 75 years later, we renegotiate.
I believe that is true. 181 was seed that started Israel.
We tarred and feathered royalists,and kept slaves.We also had brave patriots and white abolitionists .Violence was forced upon the progenitors o fIsrael.
Two wrongs don’t make it right.
Not ideal, but the near-unanimity of the court was impressive.
The job now is for conscientious people around the world, especially in EU and US and Canada, to use the ruling to strongly and urgently urge their nations to stop supporting the genocide nation in every way possible. The court did not require a cease fire, but people can and must.
BDS gets globalized and legitimated like never before.
The two judges who voted against were the ad hoc judge from Israel and the judge from Uganda, which has an interesting and special relationship with Israel.
So it goes.
Hopefully it will put lots of pressure on the EU governments together with all the demonstrations in support of the Palestinian people on the continent. Lots of help for the two Irish members in the EU parliament. And a bucket of manure on Ursula v. d. Lyen.
Meanwhile,back in Ireland-its few Jews dare not walk in the street with a skullcap-so fork that place.
What do you expect? Jews, or Israelis whatever you want to call them. The Israeli Zionists call the political shots and it is what is causing the hate of Israelis, secular or not. It is much like Germany, not all Germans were Nazis and most people are more or less a-political, the same is true for Israelis and Americans if I may say so. Manipulation of public opinion has been perfected.
Instead of just calling them whatever you want to call them, why not call them what they are?
Many Israelis are not Jews.
Most Jews are not Israelis.
Many Jews are not Zionists.
There are far more non-Jewish American “evangelical Christian” Zionists than there are Jews, let alone Israeli Jews or Zionists Jews, altogether in the entire world, and to the extent that any Zionists “call the shots” in US politics, it’s been those “evangelical Christian” Zionists doing so since the 1970s.
Words mean things, and what they mean is not “whatever you want to call them.”
Instead of just calling them whatever you want to call them, why not call them what they are?
Many Israelis are not Jews.
Most Jews are not Israelis.
Many Jews are not Zionists.
There are far more non-Jewish American “evangelical Christian” Zionists than there are Jews, let alone Israeli Jews or Zionists Jews, altogether in the entire world, and to the extent that any Zionists “call the shots” in US politics, it’s been those “evangelical Christian” Zionists doing so since the 1970s.
Words mean things, and what they mean is not “whatever you want to call them.”
Well and good. However, it will go to the Security Council where the U.S. of Atrocities will veto any resolution to stop the genocide, or anything else.
Yes, and that veto will further damage the US’ reputation and relations with much of the world.
For how long? A few months, maybe a year.
We’ll see. It may, of course, take you longer to see than it takes others.
The Israelis are on the losing side already and so is Biden and his neocons.
Keeping alive and free means they have won.
Israeli Zionist politics are based on lies and brutality and human rights abuses against the Palestinian people, a house of cards. Dignity and common sense diplomacy and simple human decency are needed, but the Israeli Zionists don’t have it.
And both Hamas and the PLO deny the Palestinians human right as well. And Hezbollah wants all the Jews in Israel dead and gone.
And what is your evidence? Did the corrupt PA on the WB do anything but serve Israel? And see how the settlers treat Palestinians, all with IDF help. The US and Israel are terrorist states.
To veto an ICJ ruling of the UN’s highest court would be about as stupid as it gets.
The neocons are the dumbest people in Biden’s drawer, but that dumb?
So you’re saying they’re not as as dumb as Dmitry Peskov?
Worse, as dumb as Karine Jean-Pierre.
Has Karine Jean-Pierre hade her version of Peskov’s “fuck the IJC, we do what we want” speech yet?
I didn’t realize Peskov was opining on the UNSC. Added: Biden’s crew are as intellectually motley as it gets, IMHO.
re something relatively connected:
https://interactive.aljazeera.com/aje/2024/israel-war-on-gaza-10000-children-killed/
I found this piece to be a good journalistic editorial.
Peskov wasn’t opining on the UNSC. He was telling the ICJ to take its rulings and go fuck itself, on behalf of the person for whom he serves as spokesperson, Vladimir Putin.
It was a cowardly decision not to demand a ceasefire. The Court simply told Israel to stop any acts that could be considered genocide. To which Israel will respond: we already have, Case closed. Once again, international bodies prove how corrupt and cowardly they are. And what was an Israeli judge doing on that court? Talk about a conflict of interest!
“The Court simply told Israel to stop any acts that could be considered genocide.”
That’s all the court has reason or jurisdiction to order under the Convention.
“And what was an Israeli judge doing on that court?”
Parties to a case are permitted to appoint ad hoc judges to hear that case. South Africa’s deputy chief justice, Dikgang Moseneke also heard and voted on the case.
Opinions are more meaningful when opinionators know at least a little about the subjects they offer opinions on.
Considering the political pressure, they did a great job, they left no opening for Israeli PR tricks.
Hamas rape gangs will be hunted down and eliminated-a very very good thing.
Back your accusations with evidence , As it stands it is BS.
We have plenty of evidence of Israeli war crimes and the complicity of the USA/NATO . There is nothing to back up your BULL-SH*T.
Turn on any new program and watch the rape victims bleeding and being haled away.Face the God Damn facts.
You are beyond help.
https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/9b70da079e113a20fddc0333f862dd1746d55bda48e62919581a2770b42a54eb.jpg
Add something meanigful,even if you disagree,or go away,as you promised.
https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/993582489451b64ff863a01ace89928e77315b74949e9d70e301f2e0b81ff735.jpg
What is your problem?-don’t we have white judges presiding over trials of blacks,and vice versa? You don’t get to pick Judges or juries based on ethnicity..
In the US,we don’t get to pick the judge we want based on ethnicity.
This is a half-ass ruling…!
I gave you a thumbs-down because this sort of emotional outburst arising from ignorance and refusal to accept reality is getting damned boring in this thread.
Tenneson: “Some men see things as they are and ask, “”Why?”” I dream things that never were and ask, “”Why not?””
Of course we have to acknowledge reality, but I’m inclined to extend some rope for the occasional outburst…
But, I am perfectly calm…! BTW, now I know you have a reserved name for down-votes afraid of your true identity…!
It is now only a matter of time for both phycho-killer Nutandyahoo, and Genocide Joe getting indicted by courts around the world for the crime of committing Genocide. Imagine the President of the U.S. becoming a wanted man in so many countries around the world such that he will not be able to travel abroad for fear of being taken into custody. How is he going to do his job?
I hear Genocide Joe is already being taken to court for Genocide in California…..
That is not going to happen.
This decision should clearly illustrate the utter useless impotence of international pronouncements when placed contrary to the exercise of the tangible actions of evil power. The genocide will continue and the perpetrators and facilitators will remain untouched.
I wish it could have been a ceasefire because so many people are suffering. I guess it’s a good start, but I have lost hope that people in power actually answer for their crimes against humanity.
Touché!
Israel was going to ignore any ruling, so it didn’t really change anything all that much. Sadly.
Unless they are the losers of the conflict.
Link to Court Resolution; https://icj-cij.org/sites/default/files/case-related/192/192-20240126-ord-01-00-en.pdf
Sounds like Israel is also going to end up also having to pay reparations to the Palestinian people affected by their malice.
LOl. Israel going to pay the Palestinians for a war they started on 10/7? That not how the world works.
I think you are being a bit cynical?
You put it mildly.
Maybe they’ll compare damages inflicted by each side and whoever did the most damage pays the difference. So, a destroyed Gaza as compared to what in Israel? Even when the previous skirmishes never led to a genocidal type of response by Israel like this one, the responses have always been disproportionate. But, to you and a few others here, genocide is allowable as long as Hamas attacked Israel on Oct 7th.
Let the Arab countries who evicted their peaceful innocent Jewish populations pay reparations.
Yes. Let’s go back in history and make both sides pay. We can start with the most recent history and work our way back.
I want reparations from every big US corporation that told my parents to fork off when they applied for a job-A big big pile of gold coins,stacked to the ceiling.
Link to Court Resolution; https://icj-cij.org/sites/default/files/case-related/192/192-20240126-ord-01-00-en.pdf
Sounds like Israel is also going to end up also having to pay reparations to the Palestinian people affected by their malice.
The ruling is nothing but a reminder to the belligerents of their obligation to adhere to international humanitarian law. The International Court of Justice ordered Israel not to commit any of the prohibited acts enumerated in the Convention on the Prevention and Punishment of the Crime of Genocide, and it ordered Hamas to unconditionally release the hostages.
The ICJ did not rule on the merits of the case, and it did not order Israel to stop its military offensive, contrary to what South Africa had requested.
The Americans will do the usual CYA routine, they will remind the Israelis to kill not as many women and children, and the Israelis go on doing the same thing with American weapon deliveries just in time.
It will take the victor to sit in judgement as happened in the case against Germany. Criminals are all the same, they repeat and do it again. Getting the hostages back with nothing to give in return, not even the children Israelis keep imprisoned will be a victory for Israel.
A rule of thumb is that if both sides are somewhat unhappy, a court has hit the right balance.
Many judges tell litigants that they ought to expect exactly that if they don’t settle their dispute out of court.
So morality is relative after all, and here I thought most rational people regarded morality by its very nature to be above relativity.
Palestinians in Gaza frustrated that ICJ ruling stops short of a ceasefire
Palestinians in Gaza have welcomed some aspects of the ICJ ruling, such as orders that more humanitarian aid to be allowed into Gaza. But many have expressed anger that the court stopped short of calling for an end to Israel’s assault, which has fueled a humanitarian crisis and displaced more than 80 percent of the population.
“Palestinians generally had a sense of frustration and depression due to the fact that they were waiting for a ceasefire order, and a forced cessation of military acts,” Al Jazeera correspondent Tareq Abu Azzoum reported from Rafah.
“Despite that, they believe this is an essential step to show the world the atrocities and genocidal attacks committed by Israel inside Gaza,” he added.
Aljazeera
As someone following the decisions was quoted re humanitarian aid, ‘how do you provide aid across Gaza without a ceasefire?’
Posted above in new:
US State Department says World Court order consistent with US view
The US says ICJ’s ruling is consistent with Washington’s view that Israel has the right to take action, in accordance with international law, to ensure the October 7 attack cannot be repeated.
“We continue to believe that allegations of genocide are unfounded and note the court did not make a finding about genocide or call for a ceasefire in its ruling and that it called for the unconditional, immediate release of all hostages being held by Hamas,” a State Department spokesperson said.
as expected, CYA routine, ” we always told the Israelis to act in accordance with international law,” while making money selling the weapons to do the killing. They had nothing to do with the massacres of the Palestinian people, women and children included.
Good report but MISSING this important ICJ decision: Israel is instructed to report on the status in 30 days.
Israel doesn’t need 30 days…! They will reject the ruling in less than 24 hours…!
That is a possibility but, I truly hope not.
It took them 2 hours…!
It will be interesting to see how they handle aid food and medicine for the Gazan people. How soon will it be to let how many trucks bring aid to the people?
World Court. Has issued an order to cease fire.
The Uganda judge voted against all measures. The Israeli judge voted in favor of providing basic health services (duh, why wouldn’t one? …I guess ask the Uganda judge) but more oddly, in favor of preventing and punishing incitement of genocide toward Palestinians. Odd considering he also voted not to prohibit destruction of evidence and require finding missions. And in other measure, against Israel military being told to not commit genocide – defined by Article 2 of the Genocide Convention). Some kind of strange metric that he thinks those two votes makes Israel look better?
The Uganda judge is a woman, Julia Sebutinde. In her dissenting opinion, she said that the dispute is a political one and “not a legal dispute susceptible to judicial settlement by the Court.” That, of course, is nonsense. She also claimed that South Africa didn’t demonstrate that Israel is acting with genocidal intent, so the acts can’t fall within the definition of genocide. That is also nonsensical; the South African brief is overflowing with examples of statements by Israeli officials openly proclaiming genocidal intent.
I have no idea what Sebutinde is thinking. The Uganda ambassador to the UN posted on Twitter a statement including the assertion that her “ruling at the International Court of Justice does not represent the Government of Uganda’s position on the situation in Palestine.”
Uganda judge Is an idiot…!
anyone who dares disagree with you is therefor an idiot.
https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/0fef75a12f39b91a25b396119321627b29244b0bb292cb415e8ac17b2d39ae90.jpg
Lol…!
The real surprise is that only she and the Israeli ad hoc Judge were the only two opposing.
Yes, I don’t think many well-informed observers expected this near-unanimity.
This is working out well:
Israeli strikes on Gaza kill several civilians, Palestinian news agency says
Wafa reports that Israeli attacks on the southern city of Rafah have killed at least one man and wounded many others. The man was killed when a bomb hit a group of tents sheltering displaced Palestinians, the news agency said.
Elsewhere in central Gaza, Wafa reports, Israeli air strikes killed at least three Palestinians.
Surely you knew, since absolutely everyone knows, that Israel wouldn’t promptly comply with any order of the court it didn’t want to comply with.
Yes, but since there wasn’t a direct call for a ceasefire, the US and Israel are arguing that they are following international law.
Of course. And if there had been a call for a ceasefire, they would have argued that it exceeded the court’s authority and there would be plenty of international law experts to tell Western media audiences that they were right. And they would have used it to double down on the claim that the court is trying to deny Israel’s right to self-defense (which it doesn’t have).
Most of the world knows that Israel is engaged in genocide and that the US is enabling it. This ruling validates that view and will embolden opponents of genocide everywhere.
This is a win. A big win. Really.
The US zombies and state department stenographers are making sure it isn’t.
They can’t. They might be able to protect Israel from UNSC action, they might be able to bullshit much of the US population, but they aren’t going to be able to control the world.
Watch Europe. It’s going to be very difficult for nations there to ignore this ruling and even harder for them to continue to actively support Israel.
We’ll see.
Napolitano’s show has gotten so much better since he was freed from establishment news.
Yes, absolutely.
I always wondered what the fuck he was doing there (FOX) in the first place.
Eloquent!
Just as I suspected
A “play nice” order to Israel. No order for a cease fire, no order for the IDF to leave Gaza. Just be more careful.
But the Israelis can’t say they were not treated fairly.
They can’t weaponize the ICJ ruling.
They already are. They are claiming it is antisemitism. In the end, though, that word will be meaningless.
That’s not weaponizing the order, that’s dismissing it. It was always inevitable that Israel would dismiss/reject it. Much of the world won’t
“Antisemitism” is already being weaponized in the US as cause for firings, censorship, blacklisting, etc.
Weaponizing antisemitism is not weaponizing the ICJ order. With respect (and some frustration): Words have meanings.
Of course it is. It not only is being used to discredit the court, but it is a means of making the court an enemy of Jewish people, who are “victimized”.
There is not teeth behind the ruling, and, the U.S. will veto any resolution concerning the matter that comes before the Security Council.
It is meaningless.
Oh no, it’s growing. I see it in comments where people are making broad brushstrokes. Not here, but elsewhere. And Netanyahu and the US are contributing to it, by using it as a cudgel. Crying wolf and weaponizing antisemitism as a tool to kill off dissent is creating an atmosphere where it won’t be believed in genuine cases.
It has become meaningless already, the reality is hitting home, Zionism is the real thing for the Zionist nation, not Semitic genetics, they share that with the Palestinians.
Zionism was a dream to end the nightmare of escaping Christian persecution.
Well, the Palestinians want to escape the Zionist occupier of their country, they have a right to live in their sovereign homeland, or not?
The Palestinians and Jewish people used to live together in Palestine, but the Zionist nationalists wanted all of Palestine and they still do. Now the Zionists are the modern day Nazis.
They sure can. For 120 years,Arabs attack,get their butts kicked, and then run to the UN or some other organization.
What they can say is the ICJ see the justification in Israel defending itself by counter attacking Hamas in Gaza. What they said is just be more careful.
They did not even mention self-defense of the occupier against the occupied.
That issue has been settled, the occupier has no right of self-defense against the occupied.
That does make sense.
Typical quote from chairman whoever-so I can say that King David built Jerusalem,and it belongs to his progeny,not people from Saudi Arabia. Someone who is antiwar should be for negotiation of differences,and everyone having a right to legitimate self defense.
Just logic, nothing else.
Regurgitation.
https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/d175576124f4718ef82cfcde5492ff5c038c18096e5cd00e0e02985fdca22437.jpg
Cedar Waxwing I presume. If you dont like what I say,leave the site,as you promised.
https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/810ea4a8eb76bf4c99cfb8a05df2db698e7c462814072028f98741578be2a832.jpg
https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/810ea4a8eb76bf4c99cfb8a05df2db698e7c462814072028f98741578be2a832.jpg
If it does damage to Israel’s reputation,,,what’s left of it, that’s a good thing although the U.S. and Israel will ignore it. But all these things taken together will have an impact upon the two in time.
It is not a final judgement. An international real investigation for the whole world to see would be the cherry on the cake.
MSM may not report, but Al Jazeera will.
Kudos to S. Africa.
It can take years.
It will take years. That’s how it works in the real world of the ICJ.
This is only a piece of the picture. But it’s an important piece that will help shape the world view of Israel and the US and is very likely to have significant impact on the world’s relations with both countries.
We’ll see. It’s better than not acknowledging what we all know to be true with our own eyes and ears. But if it was acting without influence, it would have called for a cease fire.
“But if it was acting without influence, it would have called for a cease fire.”
There’s no basis for that claim.
This court, as is typical of courts in Western legal traditions, followed a normal course of ordering no more than the minimum required to prevent the potential continuing commission of the charged-but-not-proven offense. I don’t think any international court has ever ruled that preventing war crimes requires the cessation of fighting and, certainly, the chances of such a finding at the stage of what amounts to a preliminary injunction would be vanishingly small.
As a practical matter, for Israel to conscientiously comply with the order would mean undertaking a unilateral ceasefire, so you’re complaining about a distinction that, while important as a mater of law, would make no meaningful difference in practice.
Again, I disagree that a cease fire ruling wouldn’t have more impact.
Yes, you disagree, but you don’t provide a credible argument for your disagreement. Nor do you seem to accept that a limited order of this sort is exactly what most courts would issue in a case like this, at this stage of a proceeding.
Further, ordering a ceasefire would almost certainly backfire by providing Israel and the US a basis for arguing, in rejecting such an order, that the court exceeded its authority.
If the court has no authority to order a cease fire, why would this not be included in their judgement?
What “most courts order” at this stage does not intend that new precedents should not be made in extreme cases that are abundantly obvious and well recorded.
Really, you should stop. Reality is real and you’re just stubbornly arguing against it. That’s a surefire way to make yourself ineffective in achieving goals.
To you reality is tradition without exception. I obviously have no impact on an international court ruling so how you equate my opinion as a goal is diversionary.
The court could have ruled for a cease fire and it would have been challenged. So what? They are already challenging the ruling today.
Yes.
The determination goes to the Security Council. The U.S. of Atrocities will veto any demands to bring Netanyahu and Biden to justice. It is all moot.
Meanwhile,South Africa’s leaders sing “kill the Boer”,and South Africa is a poverty stricken, crime ridden hellhole.
Meanwhile your beloved Israel will be pushed further into the abyss, boycotted, and most likely attacked on all fronts.
South Africa is being praised, while Israel’s international reputation is getting destroyed.
Nukes will quiet some of the scum,and people will always buy what they need.
If Israel ever uses a nuke especially in this now anti-Israel climate it will cease to exist. One nuke and Israel is done…
We will see when North Korea or Russia does it,nothing will happen.no one will do squat.
Well, I hate to say it, but what about us, have you noticed the homeless numbers, children going to bed hungry, people with no health care, crumbling cities and infrastructure, rotting education and much more like drugs and crime. And the USA is the wealthiest nation we are being told.
For many Americans this country is a hell hole.
As far as drugs go,the problem is self inflicted.
Why do we have a big drug problem, what is the cause? IMHO, to a large extent I believe our broken families have a lot to do with it. Poverty is very destructive to families and so is the neglect caused by parents chasing money and fame.
Wow-now you might be making sense! We live in an age of miracles. Poverty does crush the soul,drugs destroy brain capacity,common sense, and decency.There is no justifying the senseless violence infecting our country-road rage,drive buys,petty theft,delusions of entitlement. Crime rates did not explode during the depression,before the rise of the welfare state.Out of wedlock births were not acceptable.
Wow, you have come a long way.
The Biden family is a good example.
What was it that threw Hunter Biden under the bus?
Psychiatry recognizes the existence of the sociopath,and politics is full of them.I view politics as a disease and a depravity,akin to heroin use.
That is a very interesting comment you made. You are right, just there are some exceptions to the rule.
Yes, South Africa deserves kudos galore for their bravery, insistence for justice.
Get with reality.
They know that years down the road, it will be a forgotten episode. Palestinians will be dead, the living dying. Israel will have magnificent beach communities, things will be just wonderful, so very Jewish, a Jewish state where others who have a different religion are lesser citizens. Their children will be taught about the magnificent battles against the dastardly, evil Palestinians, just as in the past, looking to 1948 and its history, just as Miko Peled was taught. Netanyahu, or his replacement, will visit the halls of the U.S. congress to address both houses of congress, receiving resounding standing applause. There will be no “impact”. It will be forgotten.
“They know that years down the road, it will be a forgotten episode” It may not even be years. Just today multiple nations suspended aid to Gaza. Think about that? Fresh off of ruling that some believe Israel committed genocide and aid to Gaza gets suspended!
https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/3f3a103ec2ab76838a12719535bb36c931c5e36e877de10beda328fd7b36d5d7.jpg
Yes indeed, think about that. An accusation by Israel gets aid cut off to Gaza while a real live ongoing genocide continues to get funded. And those multiple nations were the US and 8 of its lackeys. And yet you think this is some kind of vindication for Isarael?
In addition to being a real dick move, “you shouldn’t have whined about the genocide, now we’re going to make it even worse” is likely to backfire in a big way.
Personally, I’d like to see Turkey send an aid flotilla to Gaza (keeping itself to international and Palestinian waters), accompanied by naval vessels with permission to sink any Israeli vessels that attack it.
In addition to being a real dick move, “you shouldn’t have whined about the genocide, now we’re going to make it even worse” is likely to backfire in a big way.
Personally, I’d like to see Turkey send an aid flotilla to Gaza (keeping itself to international and Palestinian waters), accompanied by naval vessels with permission to sink any Israeli vessels that attack it.
Agreed…! I also add this will be recorded in History Books…!
The best way to avert war, is by utilizing peace…
I think Greenwald will be interviewing Ofer Cassif soon.
https://rumble.com/v49ipqr-system-update-show-217.html
This episode was tedious with too much repetition on a couple of issues, but getting to the Ofer Cassif interview, to me, he was too invested in blaming everything on political opponent Netanyahu, ignoring history. I suppose in order to protect himself from claims of being a Hamas supporter, and legal consequence, he repeated ad nauseam “the horror of Oct 7th” like a mantra, diluting his later comments on the Palestinian atrocities and genocide, which have been stronger in written form.
It’s too bad because a lot of it I read as a politician’s screed and self preservation. Maybe I’m wrong. Just my impression on it being somewhat disappointing especially after my personal disappointment of the ICJ ruling.
*people are being arrested in Israel for the crime of liking social media comments with sympathy for Palestinians.
Will they charge Genocide Joe now too? Bravo to South Africa to standing up for actual international law instead of Biden’s “rules-based international order” that only favors war and the arms industry. 1% of Gazans are already dead? When will they stop? 5%? 50%? 100%? Stop the genocide!
Utilize Peace In The Middle East and the Whole World is your oyster!
I have perhaps erred in my wording since Jews do not actually utilize shell fish. Sorry about that. My bad.
It was actually kinda funny! ;-]
My husband is Sephardic.
Many Jews eat shellfish.
Many Jews eat shellfish.
I stand happily corrected!
You know what? War and potential World War actually makes me rather nervous.
I’m not kidding, it really does. We basically have two choices, in all this… Utilize Peace or War.
When it comes to war, I feel really out of balance. Because, I actually love you All. I rather feel, at this point in my life, you guys are my family. A family I actually really never had. An extended family. The love I feel for ALL of you is very familial?… That is very true. We all have been at this for a very long time. When is ‘enough actually enough’?
I am, essentially a coward. Not kidding. I am terrified. I am a true Pisces Chic. I can be honest about it. I literally tremble in my boots…You know what? I am actually gonna smoke some weed…lol
That is how nervous I am.
Let us truly, truly utilize Peace and let us show God, we are not hopeless. You don’t think God gets a bit tired of us?… Think about it. God does not want to fail, he wants to succeed. That is a bloody fact.
I love you Israel! I love you Palestine! Let us all truly utilize Peace, for the world, for all of us and beyond. What a true tribute that would be.
I feel like I am pontificating?… lol
Donna, you come across like a wonderful person, friend or neighbor.
🙂
Secular Jews are Jews too or not? They like and enjoy oysters, me thinks.
Now, Jews of any shade or color are Israelis, right? We can say Israelis like shell fish.
“Now, Jews of any shade or color are Israelis, right?”
No. Only Jews who are Israelis are Israelis. And not all Israelis are Jewes.
A little thought, it is a semantic thing. How does one define a Jew, by religion, genetics, politics or geography?
Judaism is a religion.
Jews are an ethnic group historically linked by, but not all members of whom still practice, that religion.
Judaism is a religion.
Jews are an ethnic group historically linked by, but not all members of whom still practice, that religion.
What is the common denominator? Genetically the Palestinians are Islamic Semites like the Jewish Semites, they do have some common ethnicity.
“Now, Jews of any shade or color are Israelis, right?”
No. Only Jews who are Israelis are Israelis. And not all Israelis are Jewes.
“Now, Jews of any shade or color are Israelis, right?”
No. Only Jews who are Israelis are Israelis. And not all Israelis are Jewes.
29 pages of words, mere words.
The so-called “opinion” of the International Court of Justice (ICJ) amounts to words, mere words. Words without the force of action.
The Yemeni government, the Yemeni people, who have been sanctioned to death, literally 100,000s of Yemeni people starving and dying from the basic necessities of life, food, water, medicine and who have had the “Dogs of War” brought upon them … act.
Not mere words by the Yemeni government, the Yemeni people, but action, military action.
The most terrorized, i.e., sanctioned … the mist warred, i.e., sanctions are acts of war, upon people on the planet act.
dennis hanna
“The so-called “opinion” of the International Court of Justice (ICJ) amounts to words, mere words.”
Yeah, law and courts are in a world of words. Welcome to reality.
Here is where the cease fire would have had an impact:
US State Department says World Court order consistent with US view
The US says ICJ’s ruling is consistent with Washington’s view that Israel has the right to take action, in accordance with international law, to ensure the October 7 attack cannot be repeated.
“We continue to believe that allegations of genocide are unfounded and note the court did not make a finding about genocide or call for a ceasefire in its ruling and that it called for the unconditional, immediate release of all hostages being held by Hamas,” a State Department spokesperson said.-Aljazeera
We expected nothing else from the Biden neocons.
Joe Biden and Antony Blinken keep repeating that they want an international rules-based system, but when the International Court of Justice (ICJ) rules against Israel’s carnage in Gaza, they dismiss the ruling.
What is it called? Hypocrisy.
What they really want is a lawless world so they can continue doing their killings.
Did they dismiss the ruling? I have not seen that comment yet, but I have not checked the news feeds in last few minutes
They are not likely to just dismiss it, they will do as always talk with a silver tongue the Israelis should honor the court’s orders, CYA, and shipping the bombs while talking. Excellent well trained skullduggery.
The strong never follow the rules,the weak get pounded with them.
Remember Craig Mokhiber? He was the director of the New York office of the UN High Commissioner for Human Rights and he resigned in October in protest over UN inaction to the slaughter in Gaza. Listen to what he had to say about the ICJ ruling:
“The court stopped short of ordering Israel to cease all military activity in Gaza,”
The ICJ Could Not Order A General Ceasefire. It Ordered Israel To Cease Fire.
https://www.moonofalabama.org/2024/01/the-icj-could-not-order-a-general-ceasefire-it-ordered-israel-to-cease-fire.html#more
Yup, b got it right. So did Knapp, here.
Ordering a general ceasefire isn’t really a measure the court could justify at this point and it could be argued that doing so is outside its authority. But there is no way that Israel could effectively comply with the order without undertaking a unilateral ceasefire.
Well, the same court did order a unilateral Russian ceasefire in Ukraine, so it’s not like it doesn’t think it has the authority to order that kind of thing.
I think it’s more about the fact that the Russian regime told the ICJ it was going to do whatever the hell it felt like, and got away with it. So now they’re phrasing their orders ambiguously enough to at least pretend that maybe someone, somewhere cares what they order.
In the Russia-Ukraine case, Russia had claimed that its invasion was an effort to stop a genocide being committed by Ukraine against the people of the Donbas (which even most of us who believe Russia acted in a perfectly predictable way in response to decades of threats and provocations think was over the top) and had rejected the court’s jurisdiction. Since Russia presented no evidence — having rejected the court’s jurisdiction — and since action against genocide is supposed to be taken in accordance with international law, issuing provisional orders to suspend military operations was a slam dunk.
There’s nothing ambiguous about the order to Israel. It just doesn’t use the language that it applied in the Russian case. That makes perfect sense, because what’s going on in Gaza isn’t a military operation against military targets. It’s a months-long series of attacks overwhelmingly on civilians and civilian infrastructure. And Israel has been ordered to stop. As you’ve pointed out, it can’t effective comply without ceasing its operations in Gaza.
Israel and the US will try to spin it, of course, but the order and what it requires are perfectly clear. And I think we’re going to find that much of the world cares very much what the court says in this case.
85. The Court deems it necessary to emphasize that all parties to the conflict in the Gaza Strip are bound by international humanitarian law. It is gravely concerned about the fate of the hostages abducted during the attack in Israel on 7 October 2023 and held since then by Hamas and other armed groups, and calls for their immediate and unconditional release.
Hamas is not even a nation. Gaza is occupied by another nation who is a party.
Russia tried to bring a case of genocide for Ukraine’s attack on Donbas. The court didn’t find that but found Ukrainians were subjected to it by Russia and ordered Russia to suspend military operations instead. Yet they couldn’t seek the direct wording of a cease fire here? Pfft
I understand your point and no it’s not a nation but it is a party to the occupation, it is a part of the legally sanctioned Resistance Party 🙂
The argument was that a cease fire couldn’t be called for because Hamas wasn’t a Nation as a member party to the ICJ. It was written on MOA. I think it is a stupid technicality if true, especially since Hamas /Gaza fall under the nation of Israel:
They can’t call for a ceasefire because Hamas is not a nation according to MOA but they simultaneously demand they return hostages.
ED:
Your posts are great because you deal with things so matter of fact. No room for doubt, which is why I appreciate them so much. You always make my day, lol.
Thanks Donna.
Is Israel still allowed to kill a member of Hamas or are they now a “protected endanger species”.
Are members of Hamas also Palestinians living in Gaza? If so, then the order is pretty clear:
“Israel must, in accordance with its obligations under the Genocide Convention, in relation to Palestinians in Gaza, take all measures within its power to prevent the commission of all acts within the scope of Article II of this Convention, in particular: (a) killing members of the group; (b ) causing serious bodily or mental harm to members of the group.”
https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/ea341bd6bf0ae7225d81045e65f68d4243e04a4ffd595ba716696d5140a8a31a.jpg
What you* think, say, feel, write, and believe means nothing.
The only consequence is what you** do.
dennis hanna
*The International Court of Justice (ICJ)
**The Yemeni people, The Yemeni government
Something funky is happening with comments.
ED:
What is funky? Don’t leave us in suspense!
I tried to edit a comment and the system kept placing it as a response to a commenter I had no interaction with.
I let disqus know.
“genocide Joe.” FJB FGJ
You totally rock CT! Totally!
Today is Holocaust Remembrance Day. I extend the very best wishes to Israel, the very best and God Bless! Truly.
Now let us just take a moment now, if you will, to consider Israel’s actions, with regard to the Palestinian People…
You all trying to create another potential Holocaust?! Just sayin.
The expresión goes: Never Forget!!!
NEVER FORGET WHAT YOU ARE DOING, AS I WRITE, WITH REGARD TO THE PALESTINIAN PEOPLE?
WHAT IS THE DEATH TOLL NOW?…………………………………….
What this means is if China invades Taiwan and many Taiwanese die as a result, China can also ignore an ICJ/UN ruling requesting it to cease the war? Doesn’t it set a precedence?
No, it doesn’t set a precedent. Like the US and Russian regimes, the Chinese regime already ignores any international court rulings it dislikes.
Please provide some links.
On China? OK, here’s one.
Is that all you have? It is very little, going back to 2016 and no details. There are political issues involved and international institutions are losing credibility, because of the political influence the Western powers have. They have practically veto power.
Your predilection for cheerleading whichever murderous thug caught your fancy this week instead of paying attention to the world around you does not create an obligation on my part to act as your unpaid research assistant.
I did not ask any research from you at all, only to back up what you said.
Which I did.
But since reality conflicts with your knee-jerk sympathies, reality must be rejected.
Tibet.are they also not sentients?
what about Tibet?
“PROLOGUE
Tibet before 1959 was a feudal serf society. The serfs had no freedom, no land, and were often hungry. The democratic reform abolished serfdom and enabled millions of serfs to master their own life.
The impoverished population in the region dropped from 590,000 in 2015 to 150,000 in 2018. The net annual income of rural residents has reached 10,330 yuan (US$1,540) per person by 2017, a 13.6-percent increase year-on-year. The region’s GDP more than doubled in six years to 131 billion yuan (US$19.5 billion) in 2017, according to China’s National Bureau of Statistics. The Tibet Autonomous Region (TAR) eradicated absolute poverty in 2019. China has lifted all of its citizens out of poverty by 2020.
THE TIBET THE WORLD ACTUALLY KNEW
Many prefer not to talk about the Tibet under the Dalai Lamas. Belied by the enchanting charismatic smile and wonderfully pleasant personality of the 14th Dalai Lama, and under his and his predecessors’ direct political, social and religious leadership, was the darkest corner of China and possibly the world. ”
What does Tibet have to do with Gaza anyway ?
Please ask the Tim Horton show to do a transcript. Even if it is imperfect from someone’s phone. I know I asked already, but it shouldn’t be terribly hard.
Holocaust survivors in South Africa International Court of Justice (ICJ) for crimes against humanity; unbelievable!
It shows that the disease of antisemitism is still real.Arabs slaughter Jews-silence or its OK-they are occupiers.Jews slaughter Arabs-bring out the genocide bullshit.
https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/1600c98739219ccb8eb659ef6bb74ad662bc8ef46670041d28f8e9ebd8a9907a.jpg
Lol
Meds
When and where have Arabs slaughtered Jews in modern times? That’s utter BS, and I’m 100% Jewish.
Did you not see the Oct 7 pogrom?
Craig Murray, Alexander Mercouris, Ray McGovern and Francis Boyle discuss the meaning of the World Court’s ruling
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=zpobNGv8yjc
Thanks for the pointer. Good discussion.*
I think there was something of a consensus — albeit not an explicit one — that this case is moving forward in a way that will increasingly be extremely damaging to Israel and its supporters and enablers and that it will bring benefits to the cause of justice in the world, precisely for that reason. In the meantime, the Palestinians are likely to remain in a world of hurt, unless other forces weigh in with real effect.
So far, it’s only the Houthis.
*Except that no one should ever invite Boyle to a forum without making him promise not to focus endlessly on blowing his own horn. I first interacted with him 20-some years ago — I can’t even remember what the specific issue was — and he was doing the same thing. Every time I see or hear him it’s déjà vu all over again.
Help me so my brain doesn’t explode. Based on accusations, now more countries will help starve Palestinians who are already deep into famine.
More countries pause funds for UN Palestinian agency; Israel wants it replaced
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/more-countries-pause-funds-for-un-palestinian-agency-israel-wants-it-replaced/ar-BB1hmdA5
Yes, that’s exactly what’s happening.
Israel revealed that it has learned from interrogations of Palestinian detainees that a dozen UNRWA employees are Hamas members who participated in the October 7th attacks. Coincidentally, this emerged into world awareness on the very day the ICJ ruled that accusations of genocide against Israel are plausible and the case against that country will proceed.
In righteous anger, the US, it’s loyal lapdog, the UK, and a handful of other champions of peace, freedom and justice are suspending funding for UNRWA, which is the main lifeline the Gazans have as they attempt to survive the genocidal onslaught and siege. After all, if 12 UNRWA workers are with Hamas (which they surely are, since the
torturedinterrogatedhostagesdetainees said so), the whole lot of them (about 13,000) are probably terrorists.Netanyahu and Biden probably won’t even have the decency to take their revolvers and head to their bunkers.
The US has the greatest propaganda machinery worldwide. The fact that allies were willing to join in and further starve people in famine with no immediate alternative shows that there are no consequences of the court’s ruling.
The court gave Israel just enough plausible deniability in not demanding a cease fire (regardless of the supposed limitations) that the ethnic cleansing continues and with more support and fervor. It’s beyond words for me.
Nah, it just shows that it hasn’t immediately yielded the consequences we want. That was never going to happen.
It will happen after all are dead or displaced? After they move on to Houthis?
Most of them are displaced already. Almost certainly, many more will die. Nothing the ICJ did or could have done would have changed that reality. But the ICJ ruling definitely is changing reality in important ways.
The case goes on against Biden.
Israel wasn’t going to honor a cease fire order, so the genocide was going to continue regardless. And this same cutting off of funding would have happened also. I’m with you about wanting a cease fire order but I understand what Dissident51 is trying to say. We need to have patience and as sick as that sounds as people continue to die and suffer beyond our imaginations, it’s our only hope.
I think hope is dangerous sometimes.
We mustn’t accuse Aharon Barak of double loyalty, clearly he is only loyal to the court and interested in upholding the law.
Uganda gets $1 billion from the U.S. government every year.
Too bad both the US and Israel will pay zero attention to this. Meanwhile there is a convention convening in Jerusalem including some members of Israeli government, to discuss the future takeover of Gaza by Israeli settlers. Netanyahu of course denies support for this in front of the camera. Looks like things are going as planned.
https://www.timesofisrael.com/liveblog_entry/ahead-of-conference-on-reviving-jewish-settlement-in-gaza-pm-says-he-opposes-idea-and-government-does-not-back-it/
The world is paying attention. The US and Israel are pretending to ignore it, and that won’t be possible forever. Indeed, the freakout in the Israeli press makes it clear that plenty of Israelis understand quite well that their decades of impunity and their special place as eternal victims in the eyes of the world have now ended.
With social media and phone cameras there has been an improvement since the good old days of the Iraq wars, its’ now harder to cover up the war crimes with everyone filming.
UNRWA funding cuts condemned as ‘collective punishment’
The UN is urging countries to keep funding UNRWA, its agency for Palestinian refugees, after some of its biggest donors suspended aid donations following accusations by Israel that some staff had been involved in the Oct 7 Hamas attack.~Aljazeera