Senate Majority Leader Chuck Schumer (D-NY) has decided to keep senators in town next week to continue negotiations on a border deal that will unlock a massive $111 billion spending package that includes military aid for Ukraine, Israel, and Taiwan.
The Senate’s holiday recess was set to start on Friday, but Schumer is delaying as he says negotiations are progressing. “The Senate will return Monday. That will give negotiators from the White House, Senate Democrats, and Senate Republicans a time to work through the weekend in an effort to reach a framework agreement,” Schumer said.
House Speaker Mike Johnson (R-LA) decided to adjourn his chamber for the holidays, meaning if the Senate does reach a deal, the bill can’t be finalized until after the new year. Johnson said the House “will not wait around to receive and debate a rushed product.”
Schumer vowed there would still be a vote on the military aid package next week. “No matter what, members should be aware that we will vote on a supplemental proposal next week,” he said.
Republicans are looking for significant changes to immigration laws to make it harder for migrants to enter the country, and there are signs that President Biden is willing to give them what they want to secure the over $60 billion he wants to fund the proxy war in Ukraine for another year.
CBS News reported that the White House indicated to Congress that it would support new immigration restrictions, including giving border officials the authority to expel migrants without processing their asylum claims and a dramatic expansion of deportations and detentions.
That is a bloody lot of money for war, for anybody… I am of the rather unusual line of thinking that it is cheaper to make PEACE. I am not prepared to have my hard earned tax money distributed for war. The math doesn’t really work me, even with a calculator….
Sorry, Donna. I hate to break it to you. Biden doesn’t care about your math problem or your calculator.
Neither does Putin.
Putin does care about Russia and its people.
There’s no evidence of that.
You gotta be kidding!
No. I’m not.
If he didn`t care why did he kick out all the Western leaches , he could have sat back and counted the money while Western CAPITALISTS raped his country .
Indeed, such is the SOP of all the Washington ‘friends’. The new Gen. Tchiani of Niger just joined the charmed circle. The US extractive industry can now suplant the French in the continuing rape of Niger.
And how does that matter? Putin isn’t proposing to fleece the US taxpayers of another $111 billion.
President Putin keeps explaining how to balance the US budget but the tax and spenders in congress don’t listen.
If you actually take into account the cost of making peace on terms acceptable to Russia the math is quite clear – as the cost to the US alone would be orders of magnitude higher than the cost of supporting Ukraine.
The simple reason is that the new world order Putin desires to begin with his SMO is a world where countries are going to waste a much larger share of their GDP on defense – that alone will hurt trade enough to make continued support to Ukraine at these levels the cheaper option.
Add to this the fact that this new world order makes it much more likely that more countries will develop nuclear weapons (then the only way to secure their borders) and you might appreciate that this is also far more likely to lead to a nuclear war in the near future.
NB I’m not saying that countries should behave like this or that their fear of Russia China or other large neighbors is justified, I’m only saying that this is the path that they are most likely to take. In Europe this would likely be countries like Poland in the far east it could be countries like the Philippines or Vietnam – and yes it might seem out of their reach to many of us, but North Korea managed, so I’d say that it would not absurd to deny that they could too.
Pure, unadulterated bullshit.
You are at odds with realities:
https://www.sipri.org/media/press-release/2023/world-military-expenditure-reaches-new-record-high-european-spending-surges
But sure realities are quite bullshitty.
The only countries who fear Russia is the US with it`s NATO LACKEYS and ALLIES , the other 140 plus countries on planet Earth get on very well with Russia hence the total failure of US sanctions regards Russia .
Flat out wrong – just to mention one exception from your postulate: Georgia – in case you want more Sweden which now wants to join NATO and before it Finland also not in NATO until their fear of Russia moved them to apply to join.
Re “cost of making peace on terms acceptable to Russia”
1/ “Putin’s [NATO security] concerns cannot be entirely dismissed. Were Ukraine to join NATO, the alliance would then have a 1,200-mile land border with Russia, a situation no major power would abide, no matter how loudly the Atlantic alliance claims to be purely defensive.” NYT, “Russia Invites Calamity if It Invades Ukraine” (1/9/22)
2/ “Putin declared in the autumn of 2021, and actually sent a draft treaty that they wanted NATO to sign, to promise no more NATO enlargement. That…was a pre-condition to not invade Ukraine….So, he went to war to prevent NATO, more NATO, close to his borders.” Stoltenberg, 9/23
https://www.nato.int/cps/en/natohq/opinions_218172.htm
3/ “Arakhamiia….who led the Ukrainian negotiating team….[said] an assurance that Ukraine would not join NATO was the ‘key point’ for Russia: ‘Everything else was simply rhetoric and political ‘seasoning.’’….
“‘It was the most important thing for them,’ Arakhamiia said. ‘They were prepared to end the war if we agreed to, as Finland once did, neutrality, and committed that we would not join NATO.’
“Then-Israeli Prime Minister…Bennett, the intermediary in talks that were held only days before, has also said that was the key point: ‘Tell me you’re not joining NATO,’ Putin said to Zelensky via Bennett, ‘I won’t invade.'”
Antiwar, “It’s Unanimous: Ukrainian Neutrality Could Have Brought Peace, 12/7/23
“a 1,200-mile land border with Russia, a situation no major power would abide”
The land border between the US empire (NATO) and the Russian empire (Warsaw Pact) was more than 1,300 miles long, and both sides “abided” that for 40 years.
“The land border between the US empire (NATO) and the Russian empire (Warsaw Pact) was more than 1,300 miles long, and both sides ‘abided’ that for 40 years.”
Sigh. “Border with Russia,” Thomas…
…whereas the rationale for the Russian-dominated Warsaw Pact countries was to provide ‘strategic depth’ – to be a ‘buffer zone’ preventing NATO troops/materiel/nuclear weapons on Russia’s border.
Apart from Thomas’ reply, I should add: there was no threat of Ukraine Joining NATO until Putin started his SMO – no country can join while having large parts of its territory occupied by Russia (so as long as Ukraine claims territorial sovereignty over Crimea and Russia had it occupied they could not join).
So in order to prevent Ukraine from doing what Ukraine could not do while Putin held Crimea – he would invade Ukraine – that logic got Finland to join NATO and Sweden to apply.
So Putin wanted NATO to sign papers to the effect that they did not respect the sovereignty of Ukraine – by in effect in perpetuity denying them their sovereign right to decide what defense alliances they wanted to apply to join.
Only it was not us(NATO) who had to agree to neutrality, but us(NATO) who had to force neutrality on Ukraine.
As pointed out Ukraine could not join NATO, so how does Zelenskyy promising that they will not apply bring about peace – even Sweden is being held up by Orban, Ukraine would meet not only more opponents but also fail simply by already being in a conflict with Russia over Crimea.
“there was no threat of Ukraine Joining NATO until Putin started his SMO – no country can join while having large parts of its territory occupied by Russia (so as long as Ukraine claims…Crimea and Russia had it occupied they could not join).”
NATO could not admit Ukraine so long as it disputed Russia being in Crimea?
Michael? I got a question.
Did you actually read that somewhere? Cause I haven’t – and if it’s just your pet interpretation of ‘the implications of a NATO bylaw,’ it’s not plausible Russia would have believed it wasn’t gonna happen…
…especially while NATO and the US repeated their intention to admit Ukraine, upped Ukraine’s pre-NATO status, and kept stuffing it w/US soldiers, spooks and materiel.
No I did not, however if NATO was to admit a country already in conflict with e.g. Russia, NATO would effectively be declaring war on Russia – seeing as many NATO member countries would rather not do that at the very least one of them would veto that new country joining.
Hence even without Orban there was no chance for Ukraine to join NATO until that conflict was resolved – this is not the Ukrainian position however:
https://www.unian.info/politics/10023578-is-it-possible-to-join-nato-in-a-military-conflict.html
But effectively this is how it was seen in Europe – the basis for the Ukrainian position being that article 5 does not actually involve a requirement to commit military forces as can be seen form the quote above, but that would effectively be (exposing how weak article 5 is) or watering down how article 5 is currently interpreted.
So in the view of most members Ukraine could join if we agree that article 5 does not actually mean that we need to defend each other – i.e. NATO would not be an effective defensive alliance – few politicians would like to try to sell that interpretation to their electorates in the most pro NATO countries – so Orban would be joined by many others in vetoing Ukraine joining.
Actually the Bucharest meeting revealed that France and Germany was firmly opposed to Ukraine and Georgia joining NATO (and that was in 2008 so even before the Crimean issue).
https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/natos-ukraine-debate-still-haunted-by-bucharest-pledge-2023-07-10/
I.e. the US may say one thing and NATO general secretaries may agree, but that does not mean that a country actually has a chance to join – all member countries have to agree.
There`s no PROFIT in peace , as one war ends another is all ready being provoked , hence for ever wars , reported recently 32 US states now have a weapons manufacturer creating thousands of jobs , who in government is going to vote to end US war mongering ? .
FJB and his dweeb butt boy Zelensky.
Some people think it is a great idea to give taxpayers’ money to criminal crooks in Israel and Ukraine while allowing millions of illegal migrants into the country. Such a policy should definitely make America great again.
Who picks produce in the US? You want to eat, don’t you, jaggoff? I’ll bet someone cuts your lawn for you too. Wanna bet they came for somewhere else?
So, we can get fat and lazy. Are we better off as a nation that our corporations have busted the unions and no longer have to pay a living wage? Are we better off for our suburban culture with its all its cheesey consumerist junk?
Macro problems within our culture are beyond the scope of our discussions here. If you want to provide solutions to pop culture, capitalism, idol-worship, etc, I’ll listen but then ill point out that you’re screaming into the black hole of reality.
I understood you were preaching the benefits of hyperexploitation (lettuce pickers)…??
Why is someone going somewhere and accepting employment without your prior approval “hyperexploitation?”
Assume I’m a Cesar Chavez unionized farm worker, that lettuce picker is disastrously impacting my livelihood.
Because of why they do it;
Giant corporatist agriculture has dumbed down northerners with war propaganda and taxed the fat TV slobs ro subsidize centrally planned corporatism. Excess subsidized production is then dumped in Latin America and small farmers can’t compete so they come north.
Ironically, white TV slobs from red states that can’t support themselves are taught to hate brown people who feed them. Thus white haters of brown people who have been cheated off the land hate brown people who have been cheated off the land.
Face facts; The US was founded in genocide and slavery and is still at it.
Yep. To exclaim in concert with our forefathers: Founded by landed white gentry in genocide and slavery.
hey Robert, you should ease up on the denigration of those peoples who pick your lettuce. yall boys should be careful about talking sh*t about dudes who are literally in charge of the food-chain.
Those who print and distribute $$$, they are in charge of the food-chain.
is the banker the same guy that picks your lettuce and puts it in a box ? money is not everything
The low qualification workers are easily replaceable. The government must control the situation with migration of the labor. It is not difficult to organize a recruitment of any number of foreign seasonal labor. Why not make contracts with them, for example, for six months? Come, work, take your money and go back home to your family into your own country. Next year come again if you wish.
Well, that’s not as complex as the current system.
But neither is it as simple as people minding their own business instead of pretending others need their permission to travel and work.
Of course you need a permission if you are going to work in a foreign country.
the guys that pick the produce are hispanic guys who have a federal/state pass to cross the border and pick the produce and when the season is done they cross back home until next year when they show up again and literally do the jobs that Americans will not do. that is the definition of migrant.
hey f*ck you pal because my Beanies would literally mow your lawn for free.
Hey, dips**t. So, everyone coming over the border has a “pass” to cross the border? Then what’s the problem?
Also, did you use a racial slur or is that a name for migrant workers I’m unfamiliar with?
If we lock up the border to keep migrants out, and infuriate the world with our warmongering so much that no one will trade with us, then any Americans who want their lawn mowed or to have food to eat will have to do it themselves, or pay enough to persuade another American to. Sounds good to me. If these are really jobs that Americans won’t do, they shouldn’t be done.
I have no problem with immigrants and migrants. my grandparents were immigrants. But we have so many homeless right now. They’re letting in tons of people so they can get enlistment up for the military. Most Americans are sick of the unnecessary wars that profit the rich, so enlistment is down. What better way to get more cannon fodder for world war III than bringing in poor desperate people who’s countries were destroyed by empire building?
They are not illegal immigrants! Get ir straight. Latinos decide ti leave behind family and friends because the US destabilizes south of the border with the same cruelty Israelis direct at Palestinians.
And north of the border cheap labor is wanted to keep labor cheap, no other reason.
Israel gets $0.
Taiwan gets $0.
Ukraine gets $0 and maybe some leftover cookies from Nuland.
yeah that will happen
Peace sells, but who’s buying?
I’d like to contribute 0 Nuland cookies to the Zelensky Flush Fund.
Schumer willing to work overtime for defense contractors and protect those Blackrock rebuild rights. But fighting for anything of substance for Americans…
Instead of working on a border deal, how about working on a deal to stop the violence in Gaza, and the West bank; may we add to that the violence being made in southern Lebanon.
…as if a border deal is going to stop any of the killing.
“”(southern U,S,) Border deal to get Ukraine aid”
WTF that is the very convoluted sh*t that uncle sam holds over at least most of the American peoples.
“hey you morons, if you give us the funds for whet we really want then we will pretend to release some funding for what you want”.
If Dave could have chosen “Israel Aid” in lieu of “Ukraine Aid”, his title was more truthful…!
… And what is Senate…? Israel’s Saver Chamber…!
Use the $111 billion to complete the border wall and deport all illegals?
“Make America East Germany Again” may not be any worse than foreign military adventurism, but it’s certainly not any better either.
Should’ve been an East Germany 30 years ago.
Some people just want to go back to cheap labor at it used to be before Cesar Chavez.
“Farm workers in California faced terrible working conditions before Cesar Chavez. They were subject to low wages, no job security, no benefits, and very few comforts along with other severe conditions 12. For instance, grape pickers in 1965 were making an average of $.90/hour, plus ten cents per “lug” (basket) picked. State laws regarding working standards were simply ignored by growers. At one farm the boss made the workers all drink from the same cup “a beer can”in the field; at another ranch workers were forced to pay a quarter per cup. No ranches had portable field toilets. Workers’ temporary housing was strictly segregated by race, and they paid two dollars or more per day for unheated metal shacks-often infested with mosquitoes-with no indoor plumbing or cooking facilities. Child labor was rampant, and many workers were injured or died in easily preventable accidents. The average life expectancy of a farmworker was 49 years . “
MEDICAL ACTION LEAGUE !
to help actual peoples in need
Dr. Kiss-Kiss
uncle sam to the rescue
what
Any aid given to Ukraine is money thrown down a rat hole. Russia can eliminate any and all military weapons given to Ukraine.
If you were wondering where the F-16s are, five ostensible are no more. The expensive Kinzhal hypersonic missiles took out a hangar in western Ukraine were these F-16s were being prepared for service.
Russian ‘KINZHAL’ Destroyed Five F-16 Fighters and Another US PATRIOT System In UKRAINE!
BULLSEYE! Russian ‘KINZHAL’ Destroyed Five F-16 Fighters and Another US PATRIOT System In UKRAINE! ***************************************************** Over the past 24 hours, the expert community and ordinary network users have begun to furiously discuss the details of the recent missile attack by the Russian Aerospace Forces. With each passing hour, new details of this brilliant operation appear, shocking the top leadership of NATO and the Pentagon. Moreover, insiders at the Ministry of Defense of Ukraine report that Minister Rustem Umierov has requested an urgent meeting with the top military leadership of Western countries in order to discuss the consequences of this missile attack…………. *****************************************************