A Ukrainian official said Thursday that the US and Ukraine have started talks on security guarantees for Ukraine, part of a plan for Washington to provide long-term military support for Kyiv.
The US and other G7 nations vowed at the recent NATO summit in Vilnius to negotiate their own bilateral security deals with Ukraine. “It is symbolic that the United States — our biggest strategic partner — became the first country with which Ukraine has started this process,” Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky’s chief of staff, Andriy Yermak, wrote on Telegram.
“Through this process we will create a successful model for other partners,” he said. Yermak added that the security guarantees “will strengthen Ukraine along the path to future membership of the Euro-Atlantic community, including NATO and the European Union.”
Yermak did not say where the talks are taking place or who is involved. According to Reuters, a photo accompanying his Telegram post showed him sitting at a table that appeared to be in the Ukrainian presidential office in Kyiv.
While Ukraine walked away from the Vilnius summit without a clear roadmap on when it will join NATO, the US and its allies still made clear that they want to keep funding the proxy war against Russia. Long-term commitments from Western countries will prolong the conflict as one of Russia’s main motives for invading was Ukraine’s alignment with NATO.
President Biden has publicly floated the idea of an Israel model for Ukraine, which would involve multi-year commitments to provide billions in military aid but would not include NATO Article 5-style mutual defense guarantees. Israel receives $3.8 billion in military aid annually under a 10-year memorandum of understanding.
Great… Another Israel.. Glad we are in such wonderful wonderful financial shape that we can adopt and support other countries..
we can adopt and support other countries..
And their populations too when the client state goes belly up.
Yes, another Israel. This time the Ukrainians are the Palestinians. They’ve been fed into this meat grinder of a war by US Straussian neocon psychos who want to expand this conflict to first go to Moscow, then take Beijing! Just like Israel’s Samson Option, they see WWIII as a good thing.
To be clear that I’m not being anti-Semitic or racist, I’m talking about the neocons when I say they remind me of Willie Nelson’s, “(WWIII is) always on my mind.” I wish it were “love is” instead. (Sarcasm)
That Straussian neocon cabal is a death cult if there ever was one.
Like Voltaire once said, “I wouldn’t be surprised…” He also said: “To succeed in the world it is not enough to be stupid, you must also be well-mannered.” Then MLK said, “Nothing in all the world is more dangerous than sincere ignorance and conscientious stupidity.”
Snoop Dogg staggered out of Willy’s house once.
LOL a couple of idiots what
LOL. By the way, being a man and an idiot, “love” was not my first truthful choice. I decided to keep it clean, if you know what I mean. (Sarcasm)
idiot LOL
Staggered?
Old Willie smoked Dogg under the table causing the staggers?
Willie still has it!
I’d pay to see that battle royale. That is, if I couldn’t be a contestant.
So sad. The man has the right to call out a spade without a disclaimer.
Voltaire did and dude! That was centuries before he knew there were going to be nuclear weapons!
When the war is all over save the crying, Ukraine will be a failed Rump State without access to the Black Sea. The West will soon lose interest in sending Ukraine anything of value.
If the Russians leave anything left of Ukraine it will be for the purpose of letting Poland and Hungary fight among themselves and the Bandarites for the spoils.
Yes, if by doing that they could avoid an insurgency.
No, if by doing that they’d be setting up a generation-long insurgency.
The Russians will leave enough Uks alive to give NATO some sleepless nights but nowhere enough to pose an existential threat to themselves.
https://twitter.com/ragnarbjartur/status/1687034452000587777?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1687034452000587777%7Ctwgr%5E05c94691eb971507e97550a9c0eb4f0826919daa%7Ctwcon%5Es1_&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.dailykos.com%2Fstories%2F2023%2F8%2F3%2F2185000%2F-Ukraine-Invasion-Day-527-Vasylivka-Robotyne-axis-progress
Word around the campfire is that Moscow is already having very low-key talks with Poland regarding handing over Lvov to the Poles. Nothing definite, but certainly not out of the question.
Problem with that is Pols want the land but they don’t want the population. I really don’t think Russia will allow genocide of west Ukraine or new east Poland. It’s counter intuitive to their anti-imperial agenda.
I see my tankies are still trying to will a Russian victory. Keep it up gang! Hahaha.
Oh, BTW, the Russians might be another ship short on their way to “victory”!
https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zone/ukrainian-drone-boat-scores-direct-hit-on-russian-warship
Laugh it up, Naziboy. That ship is going to be repaired and back in the fight.
The Russian victory will be God’s will – and his alone… And inevitable!
God has a piece of this action? Hahaha. Snuggle up with your bible and watch what happens.
You really don’t read many articles at antiwar.com, do you?
https://twitter.com/wartranslated/status/1686660439839543296?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1686660439839543296%7Ctwgr%5E1aacfdd40eb53173b94258596235d36391a1d751%7Ctwcon%5Es1_&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.dailykos.com%2Fstories%2F2023%2F8%2F3%2F2184894%2F-More-Russian-stuff-blowing-up-plus-weeds-are-the-new-enemy-of-Ukraine
You really don’t read many articles at antiwar.com, do you?
I agree that Russia will almost certainly do all in its power to leave Ukraine as a toothless rump state. I’m not sure about moving to and taking Nikolaev and Odessa, cutting off all access to the sea, but I think Russia would prefer that, if it doesn’t trigger a direct shooting war with NATO. No one has forgotten the Trade Union Building massacre.
I think the US will continue to encourage Rump Ukraine’s Dead-enders of the Lost Cause attack Russia and Russian interests in whatever ways they can, but I think you’re right that the fire hose of weapons and money won’t keep flowing.
“I think the US will continue to encourage Rump Ukraine’s Dead-enders of the Lost Cause attack”
Yes, they dream of an insurgency Afghan-style to bleed Russia by making Ukraine uninhabitable for its people.
Can they get away with that? First, Russia would have to stop in a position leaving it open to that. Then second, in addition the Ukrainian people would need to be convinced to elevate their hatreds over survival.
Both are possible of course. See Palestine. Afghanistan did happen, to both the Soviets and then to the US.
But now it is a “possible” for which there are visible bleeding examples from which to learn. Both sides would need determined blindness to ignore those examples and do it to themselves again.
BlackRock already owns it. The US paid off Ukraines debt, but we lose entitlements here because debt.
And it means absolutely nothing to anyone outside of Anglo-American empire. Null and void from the start.
It’s just a huge money laundering operation like past wars.
I don’t think so. Ukraine will survive and prosper after the clean up of Pentagon filth is complete. Same thing with Europe.
“Security Garantees ”
So that is what they call the talks about how “this has to end because we can’t keep this going”.
It does not matter what they claim the topic is (of course security garantees that we will keep the spigot open was part of it) but that they are speaking about “after” is significant and that they told us (and the Russians) they are speaking officially about what happens after may have significance too.
Ukraine’s big push has been determined to be a bust to the point the usual suspects are getting stories in the press placed sharing they knew it was not going to work (the usual DC butt-covering as things wind down) and now we have a story put out about security garantees after it’s over.
Sometimes in wars at the end there is a huge crescendo (battle) but you know it is ending when the huge crescendo is just a whimper without any territorial gains, just barely defended hamlets that are not even behind their main line and 10’s of thousands dead with much less of your enemy dead.
“It is symbolic that the United States — our biggest strategic partner — became the first country with which Ukraine has started this process,” Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky’s chief of staff, Andriy Yermak, wrote on Telegram. “Through this process we will create a successful model for other partners,” he said. Yermak added that the security guarantees “will strengthen Ukraine along the path to future membership of the Euro-Atlantic community, including NATO and the European Union.”
You really have to be an imbecil to trust the people that won’t supply you with enough weaponry to win this war because of fear of a direct conflict and who said they didn’t think the counteroffensive would be successful but they HOPED that it would.
It’s pretty amazing … I don’t know what the serious Ukrainian military people (presuming there are still some) are thinking …
They are not stupid. Just evil. They get paid to dance they way the parasites in Washington and London want them to dance.
This is an attempt by the US to gain what Russia fights to prevent — a US military position in Ukraine.
This is what the war is about. The US may win or lose, but if it loses it won’t be able to win anyway by this sort of side deal.
Thus, this is a distraction. It paints the aggressive actions of NATO expansion as “peace” and as a solution to the problems presented by a war that was provoked by doing exactly this.
$$$$$$. Just like the pandemic. Overstate a crisis and shift money upwards. Shock Doctrine. Keep people in fear that they will lose something. Meanwhile no one is really doing an accounting of the pentagon budget and where the money went. Money laundering.
Unless and until Russia and Belarus are involved in these talks, it will all be for naught. The attrition phase of the war is slowly coming to an end.
The US and other G7 nations vowed at the recent NATO summit in Vilnius to negotiate their own bilateral security deals with Ukraine
“vowed” wow that is actually a word “vowed”
i made a vow long ago – i vowed to make sure that my mama and my friends and my neighbors and my children and my children’s children would always have something to eat.
SANDWICHES mother-f*ckers, yalls, SANDWICHICHES
I have made vows. To keep my late mother in her own home to her last breath. To my late wife. To my kids now.
Those are vows.
Is that what they are doing? Nah.
It is the sort of “100% behind him” that means tomorrow will see a stab in the back. This was explained about a recent President, when he promised that to TV cameras, a day before withdrawing a nomination.
Yeah.
This doesn’t sound like a “vow” to me:
Today we are launching negotiations with Ukraine to formalize — through bilateral security commitments and arrangements aligned with this multilateral framework, in accordance with our respective legal and constitutional requirements — our enduring support to Ukraine as it defends its sovereignty and territorial integrity, rebuilds its economy, protects its citizens, and pursues integration into the Euro-Atlantic community. We will direct our teams to begin these discussions immediately.
We will each work with Ukraine on specific, bilateral, long-term security commitments and arrangements towards: [blah, blah, blah]
Nor does this:
In the event of future Russian armed attack, we intend to immediately consult with Ukraine to determine appropriate next steps. We intend, in accordance with our respective legal and constitutional requirements, to provide Ukraine with swift and sustained security assistance, modern military equipment across land, sea and air domains, and economic assistance, to impose economic and other costs on Russia, and to consult with Ukraine on its needs as it exercises its right of self-defense enshrined in Article 51 of the UN Charter. To this end, we will work with Ukraine on an enhanced package of security commitments and arrangements in case of future aggression to enable Ukraine to defend its territory and sovereignty.
https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/g7-joint-declaration-of-support-for-ukraine-12-july-2023/joint-declaration-of-support-for-ukraine
Sandwiches got pretty expensive.
So essentially the ‘security guarantee’ proposed by Biden is nothing more than a blank check. Now tell me how the Ukraine is going to reciprocate in any way like Israel is supposed to. If the US starts something with Iran- as it looks like we’re trying to do- will we see Ukrainian fascist Azov types fighting alongside the US Marines and Navy? We’ve never seen the Ukraine commit troops to anything we’ve done in the past, so why offer them future billions when they have never even offered their help?
Actually, Ukraine sent troops to “assist” NATO in Afghanistan, for quite a long time. There weren’t many and I don’t think they engaged very much in actual combat missions, but they were there.
Iraq too.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ukrainian_involvement_in_the_Iraq_War#:~:text=Prior%20to%20the%20Russo%2DUkrainian,and%2018%20Ukrainians%20were%20killed.
De facto they were NATO members, the same as the Swedes, which left their neutrality a long time ago.
But the Swedes and the Fins have money to fund American interests, Ukraine has nothing to contribute anymore, not even cannon fodder.
That was true for German troops too, but Germany funded the military too, as they did in the Gulf War.
It was not a real NATO military issue.
The USA/NATO wants to hold on to Ukraine just in case there is an opportunity for NATO to start WW III against Russia.
goddamnit. in the mid-late ’80s i actually met a couple of soviet guys – they somehow made their way all the way over to Los Angeles. i kid you not their goal was to be the next Eddie Van Halen – i was like, “what are you stupid?” and the dude was like “check this out! – beedle deedle eedly doo!” (on his guitar) and i said hey figure out the C-major scale and then get back to me, because that’s what real musicians play – the C-major scale.
idiots.
I did not know the US is about to attack Ukraine. The G7 are broke already. There will be no NATO left to join, but maybe talking like there is a NATO feels good.
Washington can’t be trusted, the US will walk away and leave Ukraine and Europe in the lurch. They did it not too long ago in Afghanistan.
Biden wants to get reelected and that is all he has to offer?
He is an old man, normally with age comes wisdom, just not with a demented Biden. What Idiots would vote for him? What kind of idiots form their establishment? They can’t even tell Feinstein to retire with dignity. What a bunch of disgusting Democrats.