Russian Foreign Minister Sergey Lavrov said Monday that Russian security services were investigating whether or not Western or Ukrainian intelligence agencies played a role in Wagner chief Yevgeny Prigozhin’s two-day mutiny.
When asked by RT if Russia had evidence of Western involvement, Lavrov said, “I work in a government ministry that is not engaged in gathering evidence of unlawful acts being committed, but we do have such agencies and, I assure you, they are already looking into it.”
The Russian diplomat said Western intelligence likely wanted the mutiny to succeed and pointed to US media reports that said US intelligence knew Prigozhin was planning armed action against the Russian military establishment but did not make the information public.
“In particular, CNN, if I remember correctly, reported that the US intelligence services knew for several days that a mutiny was in the works, but decided not to disclose that information to anyone, apparently in the hope that the mutiny would succeed,” Lavrov said.
Lavrov pointed to another CNN report that said US officials expected Prigozhin to face more resistance and for the insurrection to be more violent. “We assessed it was going to be a great deal more violent and bloody,” an unnamed US official told CNN.
Lavrov also told RT that the US signaled to Russia that it was not involved in Prigozhin’s uprising, a message that was delivered by US Ambassador to Russia Lynne Tracy. Later on Monday, President Biden denied that the US played any role in the crisis and said that Washington had made that clear to Moscow.
“By the way, when US Ambassador Tracy spoke with Russian officials yesterday, she sent some signals. These signals are probably not secret; they were primarily that the US had nothing to do with this, that the US is very hopeful that nuclear weapons will be okay, that American diplomats will not be harmed,” Lavrov said.
Biden also denied that the US’s NATO allies were involved in the uprising. “They agree with me that we had to make sure we gave Putin no excuse … to blame this on the West, to blame this on NATO,” Biden said. “We made clear that we were not involved, that we had nothing to do with it. This was part of a struggle within the Russian system.”
There’s been no sign that Secretary of State Antony Blinken has tried to contact Lavrov about the crisis. Instead, Blinken has been telling the media that the US expects more instability in Russia. “I think we’re in the midst of a moving picture. We haven’t seen the last act,” Blinken told CBS News on Sunday.
Discussing Ukraine’s response to the mutiny, Lavrov said Kyiv hoped the government in Moscow would have been brought down. “All of them lamented their failure to take advantage of this situation to bring down the regime,” he said.
In May, The Washington Post reported that Prigozhin was in contact with Ukrainian military intelligence and even offered them Russian troop positions in exchange for a Ukrainian withdrawal from Bakhmut. The report was based on US intelligence assessments that leaked on Discord, but the full documents were not published, and Prigozhin denied the accusations.
Who knows? There are so many theories going on and nobody remembers what Churchill said:”Russia is a riddle wrapped in a mystery inside an enigma.” And Wash. is Bull poo, wrapped in horse poo, inside dog poo.
🙂
Exactly, the pedo billionaires, their chicken-shit press, nipple-shit military, dog-shit pols, shit-mouth lobbyists ….
And H.L. Menken said: The way you know something is true in Washington is when it’s officially denied.”
Did this even really happen? The US propaganda machine has been cranked up full bore since Russia and Ukraine started this recent shooting match. The propaganda mill has been cranking out Putin getting over thrown and tin pot weapons since the beginning. There are only two countries with generation 5 fighter jets the US and Russia. Nothing can be believed.
It happened.
24 hours that shook Russia: Experts weigh in on the Wagner ‘mutiny’
From Kaliningrad to Vladivostok, and farther afield, all eyes were on what looked like a march to Moscow. Was it a one-off or an ominous portent?
Never before has information been controlled as it is now. The first thing is the tech companies like Youtube, Google, Twitter, and Facebook act as gatekeepers to all information on the internet. It’s so tightly controlled that if it isn’t far left mantra, including discussions what’s in your own pants, they won’t allow it to be discussed. The second thing is that the news is controlled by massive corporations working alongside the government. Case in point the Qanon shaman walking through the Capital Building on Jan 6th. For not months, but years, all the broadcast companies said this man broke the window’s of the building and crawled inside. A brave broadcaster showed what really happened on that day and the Capital police opened the door and escorted around. Did they recant that story? No. All the broadcast companies doubled down repeating the lie regarding the Qanon shaman and fired the broadcaster. Now we are talking about information that happened in Russia that is on the otherside of the Ukraine conflict. You don’t think the Russian government controls the information coming out of their territory, they always have. This is not taking in account irregularities in the story itself. Some people in this country believe that they are well informed. Anything coming out of these broadcast corporations are about as real as ghosts, Big Foot, and the Lochness Monster.
Something happened, for sure. What “it” really was is still a big question.
Another great benefit that I’ve overlooked initially. This … lets call it event, provides outstanding opportunity to escalate against Anglo-American empire and leaves Russian Federation and Kremlin looking terrific on the global stage. I expect hardliners in Kremlin to push this to the limit. They may even get a strike on imperial assets.
Maybe.
But I’m still betting on Putin not being a fucking idiot. Over the course of his tenure, he hasn’t made very many really big mistakes.
You’re under a false impression that he is a sole dictator. I recommend taking a deeper dive into Russian politics.
“You’re under a false impression that he is a sole dictator.”
No, I’m not.
I’m under a true impression that he’s mostly done a very capable job, for decades, of helping keep the machine he’s a key part of from running off the road and over a cliff.
If I had to bet on the matter, I’d bet that he’d continue to demonstrate that ability rather than let himself get pushed into doing incredibly stupid things. In fact, I’d double down on that bet, because after the massive February 2022 brain fart / debacle, he presumably wants to redeem his reputation.
Other than waiting eight years to do the right thing.
Could be. If Prigozhin made a deal to save his men from Ukrainian military antihalation because of no support from the Russian military higher ups. It’s very possible he made a deal. Then the question becomes why did the Russian military higher ups leave Prigozhin and his men high and dry. This doesn’t pass the smell test does it? Lets play devils advocate here. Did Putin strike a deal with the West and its globalist masters or maybe even China and its interests? To help eliminate Prigozhin and his men? Who are a thorn to the globalists and China interests in Africa for a ceasefire in Ukraine at current demarcation lines? Like I said this doesn’t pass the smell test.
Maybe the Russian state military, used to victory parades, money and women, got jealous watching a caterer and a bunch of prison inmates getting all the headlines. Maybe this little fake operation was cooked up by Putin (an ex KGB officer) and Wagner to see who jumped on the bandwagon a little too soon.
Russia will blame this and all anti-Putin demonstration on CIA subterfuge. The democrats shout Russia, Russia, Russia. Putin supporters will chant CIA, CIA, CIA.
“Maybe this little fake operation was cooked up by Putin (an ex KGB officer) and Wagner to see who jumped on the bandwagon a little too soon.”
That’s a possibility. As is the idea that Putin and Prigozhin cooked it up to discredit Shoigu and Gerasimov. As Anatol Lieven points out at Responsible Statecraft today, those two have been a dual train wreck of epic proportions:
“Prigozhin’s attacks were so damaging to the regime both because of the prestige that Wagner amassed in Russia as a result of its fighting record in Ukraine, and because his criticisms have been essentially true. Not only did Shoigu and Gerasimov plan and conduct the invasion of Ukraine with monstrous incompetence, recklessness and indifference to civilian deaths and suffering, but since they have both held their present positions since 2012, they bear direct personal responsibility for the logistical chaos, lack of coordination, and generally lamentable condition of the Russian armed forces.”
Nice link.
That’s good too.
Far from it being a spontaneous, 1-man protest march by Prighozyn and a tiny minority of Wagner fighters, the evidence emerging since the doomed ‘coup’ is consistent with it being part of a western orchestrated plan to unseat Putin, that the Russian FSB and SVR knew about from a very early stage.
I note Putin directly referred to involvement by overseas actors (in particular, ‘western patrons’) in his most recent speech.
If western governments are involved and the Russians know it, it’s a blatant act of war and their most reckless and quite frankly stupid idea yet, since the Russian invasion in February 2022.
This never had a chance of success. It has backfired spectacularly, with Putin emerging even stronger than before, Russia more unified and an even worse situation for Ukraine/NATO on the battlefield. All western hopes for a future coup in Russia have now been destroyed.
Not just that. Moscow will also likely let every government that they have friendly relations with, including of course Beijing, know most of the details.
Despite disaster after disaster, Western leaders continue to act with extreme hubris and recklessness vis-a-vis Russia. They get everything wrong, 24/7, appear to assume that they will never be held accountable and that there will never be consequences, for their decisions.
And yet, Russia is still losing…
losing what?
The SMO for one; China for another. (Please try to keep up.)
https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2023/6/27/dont-see-why-not-china-envoy-on-backing-ukraines-91-borders
You cite Aljazeera and some Chinese diplomat?. Did you even read the article?
Sock puppets are not what they use to be.
Ahhh. Perhaps a Russian outlet and a Russian diplomat? Hahaha
I need your supervisors number, to make a complaint about your subpar comeback.
Biden, Blinken, Yellen, and many others in the administration have proven the ‘Peter Principle’ in effect in that many in government rise much beyond their level of competence.
As the Gray Zone reports:
https://consortiumnews.com/2023/06/26/casualties-of-russian-civil-war-beltway-experts/
There are a lot of connected neocons with egg on their faces. Now I wonder if these carrion birds got tips from their blabber mouth brethren on the inside that something really big was up? In this late, corrupt empire, anything is possible.
But boy, oh boy, if this is true, if US elements were involved here … remember the noise about russian involvement in 2016? Well, strap yourselves in because 2024 is going to be a RIDE.
To continue with this theater, Putin now needs to attach this tale to the western ass.
Prigozhin has no military background. He and another coowner had been supported by various Rusdian agencies.
He is a footbal club owner who pushes coaches around, and start making decisions for them. It is a real wonder that he led Bakhmut operation, giving heartburn to Russian commanders tasked with supporting him.
He was angry at the military, as they expected precise coordination, when he preferred play by ear. None of it new.
But it is likely that he was encouraged to express his anger by asking his Wagner supporters to follow him on a protest march. No commanders and no officers joined. Tge number of 8,000 is highly exaggerated. This “encouragement” may have come as a bug carefully planted into his ear.
What would have been the purpose? After all is said and done — the real value is optics. The spectre of a lose cannon Prigozhin marching into Russia. and tge need for Russian stare to have to deal with him — may have been too good to pass.
Now, it is “civil war” danger, weakening Putin, name the headline — all perfect distraction from catastrophic mess that the Ukraine counteroffensive became.
This is what happens when an owner, with no military background, takes over as a commander.
Such as he is — still managed to notch a win in Bakhmut over NATO supportecd Ukrainians that put everuthing into the defense.,
I suppose the intel groups could have found out about it without an inside source, but this certainly suggests we do have at least one person on our payroll who is working for Wagner. But why say anything about advanced knowledge, unless of course the whole story about knowing in advance is complete rot.
Where is the proof they knew about it and where is the proof of advanced planning?
Why would our intel make up a story about pre-planning and advanced knowledge you might ask? Well why not, it doesn’t cost them a penny to pretend that they knew all about it when Putin didn’t. That’s a big intel coup right? Except when do they ever get anything right?
Furthermore, I rather doubt Prigozhin needed the CIA’s help to do something like this. Not that I’d be shocked to be wrong, but I tend to think he was pissed about Wagner being disbanded and thought he would make a big splash on his way out, playing the big man who will take on the Generals, right up until the end. Not to mention that Russia would love it if their people think the CIA was in on it somehow.
And while almost everyone dismisses the idea that Wagner was actually attacked before they went on this March, I’m not 100% sure that it didn’t happen. Maybe this stuff about pre-planning it weeks in advance is correct and Russia got wind of it as well? Maybe his camp was hit, which would perhaps explain why Putin doesn’t have Prig’s head hanging over the mantle-place for the deaths of the pilots. Did someone in the Russian command order a strike, thinking they could take out Prigozhin because They had the advanced knowledge?
What are the odds that the US had better intel inside Wagner than Russia? I would think that if anyone would have known in advance it would have been Russia and who knows how far in advance or even if there was pre-planning. Has anyone in Wagner admitted to pre-planning this?
sure they did.
They want you to think they did so that’s why they’re denying it.
I have doubts that they could’t find their own a$$ with both hands.
Who?
Our spooks
ok . and of course. the usa is the top meddler in the world.
Somebody has to know if a missile really was fired, and who fired it at the Wagner camp. If it was fired, I suspect the most likely weapon would have been the British Storm Shadow missile because of Wagner’s distance from the Front at the time.
It would not be surprising for Ukraine to fire such a missile. They’ve done it before. So, we are looking for the guy who said it was fired by the Russian Army, not the AFU which would almost certainly be blamed.
I’d bet that guy has already been identified.
There is a theory that some of the $6.2 billion for Ukraine recently found due to an accounting error were offered, perhaps by the CIA to the Wagner PMC mercinaries to turn on Russia. This would be a classic attempted attempt to buy out your enemies men. Very common several centuries ago.
Maybe it was bungled.
It was not the CIA. It was the MI 6 that arranged this with Ukrainian intelligence. It was MI 6 that supervised the shooting down of MH 17 by Azov and the Bucha massacre performed by the tornadoes.
“Biden also denied that the US’s NATO allies were involved in the uprising. “They agree with me that we had to make sure we gave Putin no excuse … to blame this on the West, to blame this on NATO,” Biden said. “We made clear that we were not involved, that we had nothing to do with it. This was part of a struggle within the Russian system.” ”
Yeah, sure, you betcha. I always believe the opposite of what comes out of the Biden Administration’s mouth.
How could US media knew of this mutiny…?! From western intelligent sources which planned the event in the first place…!
No one really knows
Ukraine finally made a worthwhile advance, getting a beachhead across rhe Dneiper. Well armed with NATO weapons with decent air defense
Intermission is over, back to the main event. Probably a week of very small changes in the front lines
I’m sure everyone knew this was about to happen (it was a little more bloody than our Cox’s “Army” which marched on DC 25,000 strong in ’32 over money) but did our Vicky communicate any assurances to him prior?
Any communication he had with western security services before he decided he needed a crazy march to Moscow or wherever he was ultimately heading, is going show the West encouraged this in that Linda Graham sort of way to damage our enemy.
Where is Lindsey?
You’d think he’d be everywhere but he’s not.
It’s as if they got him in a closet somewhere lest he says something uncomfortable or revealing.
When you have a idiot like Biden to speak the unspeakable, who needs Graham?
The Russian side seems to be getting convinced that UK is behind it.
If they conclude that is true, thar the UK was behind it, then the US was correct. It is not over yet. Round 2 will not be fun.
Relatively little in the way of bloodshed so no, there wasn’t US involvement.
Here’s my conspircay theory. There was no deal in place with the US or Ukraine and this man. Ukraines military likely took control of one of their bases in an counter offensive, and brilliantly started launching Russian missiles at his army, leading him to believe Russia’s army had turned on them and started attacking. At that point, believing he was facing both Ukraine’s army in one direction and Russian in the other, he felt his best option was to fight to his death and try to take Putin down. The leader of Belerus assured him that Putin did not launch the attack and he was attacking under a false flag, and told him if he signaled he would lay down arms and retreat to Belerus, he would would not suffer a certain death in Russian for treason. Anyway, that’s my fictional version of events.
Of course he will try and shift blame to the West.
That falls under ‘well duh’.
And it matters little.
A large bunch of mercs took control over fairly large Russian cities/roads with little getting in their way.
The result is that Putin’s image has been damaged.
Whether Putinbots like it or not.
Please watch this from 16:50 (it says what I more or less think about this)…